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Run v Bike HR Zones
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JaRok2300




Joined: 01 May 2014
Posts: 186
Location: Worcester, UK

PostPosted: Tue Apr 04, 2017 8:07 am    Post subject: Run v Bike HR Zones Reply with quote

I've never had a proper test but I'm fairly happy I've got my run HR zones about right. My long runs are around the 155-160 mark (85% by Fink zones) at @10min/mile and that feels relatively comfortable and sustainable.
According to Fink, bikes zones should be 5% lower and this is what feels way out. I did a couple of 4 mile intervals on the bike last night, not balls out but a pretty hard effort for about 12 minutes and my average HR was 142. (Max 160 on a short climb each lap)
I couldn't even jog at 142bpm so is the 5% rule just as flawed as 220-age etc.
I am heavy (about 100kg) so I guess running would require a lot more effort than cycling but should my zones be so different or do I just need to grow some and work harder on the bike?
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Jgav




Joined: 06 Dec 2016
Posts: 198

PostPosted: Tue Apr 04, 2017 8:35 am    Post subject: Re: Run v Bike HR Zones Reply with quote

JaRok2300 wrote:
I've never had a proper test but I'm fairly happy I've got my run HR zones about right. My long runs are around the 155-160 mark (85% by Fink zones) at @10min/mile and that feels relatively comfortable and sustainable.
According to Fink, bikes zones should be 5% lower and this is what feels way out. I did a couple of 4 mile intervals on the bike last night, not balls out but a pretty hard effort for about 12 minutes and my average HR was 142. (Max 160 on a short climb each lap)
I couldn't even jog at 142bpm so is the 5% rule just as flawed as 220-age etc.
I am heavy (about 100kg) so I guess running would require a lot more effort than cycling but should my zones be so different or do I just need to grow some and work harder on the bike?


I'll follow the responses on this too. My bike HR is much much lower than my run HR. I think for me it might be due to lack of bike specific fitness compared to my run fitness, i.e. my legs are a the limiting factor on the bike and my CV system is the limiting factor on the runs.
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Tin Pot




Joined: 08 Jul 2013
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PostPosted: Tue Apr 04, 2017 9:42 am    Post subject: Re: Run v Bike HR Zones Reply with quote

Jgav wrote:
JaRok2300 wrote:
I've never had a proper test but I'm fairly happy I've got my run HR zones about right. My long runs are around the 155-160 mark (85% by Fink zones) at @10min/mile and that feels relatively comfortable and sustainable.
According to Fink, bikes zones should be 5% lower and this is what feels way out. I did a couple of 4 mile intervals on the bike last night, not balls out but a pretty hard effort for about 12 minutes and my average HR was 142. (Max 160 on a short climb each lap)
I couldn't even jog at 142bpm so is the 5% rule just as flawed as 220-age etc.
I am heavy (about 100kg) so I guess running would require a lot more effort than cycling but should my zones be so different or do I just need to grow some and work harder on the bike?


I'll follow the responses on this too. My bike HR is much much lower than my run HR. I think for me it might be due to lack of bike specific fitness compared to my run fitness, i.e. my legs are a the limiting factor on the bike and my CV system is the limiting factor on the runs.


It's hard to measure bike effort and relate HR to it, in my experience. I started training to power in January and that has allowed me to learn what my HR is like at different effort levels.

If it encourages, my long ride and long runs are at similar average HRs ~ 155 for the run, 140 for the bike.
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explorerJC




Joined: 20 Oct 2005
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PostPosted: Wed Apr 12, 2017 10:02 am    Post subject: Re: Run v Bike HR Zones Reply with quote

Jgav wrote:
JaRok2300 wrote:
I've never had a proper test but I'm fairly happy I've got my run HR zones about right. My long runs are around the 155-160 mark (85% by Fink zones) at @10min/mile and that feels relatively comfortable and sustainable.
According to Fink, bikes zones should be 5% lower and this is what feels way out. I did a couple of 4 mile intervals on the bike last night, not balls out but a pretty hard effort for about 12 minutes and my average HR was 142. (Max 160 on a short climb each lap)
I couldn't even jog at 142bpm so is the 5% rule just as flawed as 220-age etc.
I am heavy (about 100kg) so I guess running would require a lot more effort than cycling but should my zones be so different or do I just need to grow some and work harder on the bike?


I'll follow the responses on this too. My bike HR is much much lower than my run HR. I think for me it might be due to lack of bike specific fitness compared to my run fitness, i.e. my legs are a the limiting factor on the bike and my CV system is the limiting factor on the runs.


in a sense this is true, but you are also asking your legs to do more work when running rather than cycling...
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explorerJC




Joined: 20 Oct 2005
Posts: 14471
Location: Farthingstone

PostPosted: Wed Apr 12, 2017 10:03 am    Post subject: Re: Run v Bike HR Zones Reply with quote

Tin Pot wrote:
Jgav wrote:
JaRok2300 wrote:
I've never had a proper test but I'm fairly happy I've got my run HR zones about right. My long runs are around the 155-160 mark (85% by Fink zones) at @10min/mile and that feels relatively comfortable and sustainable.
According to Fink, bikes zones should be 5% lower and this is what feels way out. I did a couple of 4 mile intervals on the bike last night, not balls out but a pretty hard effort for about 12 minutes and my average HR was 142. (Max 160 on a short climb each lap)
I couldn't even jog at 142bpm so is the 5% rule just as flawed as 220-age etc.
I am heavy (about 100kg) so I guess running would require a lot more effort than cycling but should my zones be so different or do I just need to grow some and work harder on the bike?


I'll follow the responses on this too. My bike HR is much much lower than my run HR. I think for me it might be due to lack of bike specific fitness compared to my run fitness, i.e. my legs are a the limiting factor on the bike and my CV system is the limiting factor on the runs.


It's hard to measure bike effort and relate HR to it, in my experience. I started training to power in January and that has allowed me to learn what my HR is like at different effort levels.

If it encourages, my long ride and long runs are at similar average HRs ~ 155 for the run, 140 for the bike.


What's similar about these?
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SGreg




Joined: 30 Jun 2010
Posts: 842
Location: High Peak

PostPosted: Wed Apr 12, 2017 11:34 am    Post subject: Re: Run v Bike HR Zones Reply with quote

explorerJC wrote:
Tin Pot wrote:
Jgav wrote:
JaRok2300 wrote:
I've never had a proper test but I'm fairly happy I've got my run HR zones about right. My long runs are around the 155-160 mark (85% by Fink zones) at @10min/mile and that feels relatively comfortable and sustainable.
According to Fink, bikes zones should be 5% lower and this is what feels way out. I did a couple of 4 mile intervals on the bike last night, not balls out but a pretty hard effort for about 12 minutes and my average HR was 142. (Max 160 on a short climb each lap)
I couldn't even jog at 142bpm so is the 5% rule just as flawed as 220-age etc.
I am heavy (about 100kg) so I guess running would require a lot more effort than cycling but should my zones be so different or do I just need to grow some and work harder on the bike?


I'll follow the responses on this too. My bike HR is much much lower than my run HR. I think for me it might be due to lack of bike specific fitness compared to my run fitness, i.e. my legs are a the limiting factor on the bike and my CV system is the limiting factor on the runs.


It's hard to measure bike effort and relate HR to it, in my experience. I started training to power in January and that has allowed me to learn what my HR is like at different effort levels.

If it encourages, my long ride and long runs are at similar average HRs ~ 155 for the run, 140 for the bike.


What's similar about these?


Similar to the OP?
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Jorgan




Joined: 12 Nov 2007
Posts: 16215
Location: alles was ich bin, alles was ich war

PostPosted: Wed Apr 12, 2017 1:24 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Everyone is different, which is why these generic suggestions for HR can only go so far. It's why a lot of people now use power on the bike.

For example, my long easy run at 8min/miles would be at 120 bpm; can you keep it that low when you're out of bed Wink Very Happy
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explorerJC




Joined: 20 Oct 2005
Posts: 14471
Location: Farthingstone

PostPosted: Wed Apr 12, 2017 1:25 pm    Post subject: Re: Run v Bike HR Zones Reply with quote

SGreg wrote:
explorerJC wrote:
Tin Pot wrote:
Jgav wrote:
JaRok2300 wrote:
I've never had a proper test but I'm fairly happy I've got my run HR zones about right. My long runs are around the 155-160 mark (85% by Fink zones) at @10min/mile and that feels relatively comfortable and sustainable.
According to Fink, bikes zones should be 5% lower and this is what feels way out. I did a couple of 4 mile intervals on the bike last night, not balls out but a pretty hard effort for about 12 minutes and my average HR was 142. (Max 160 on a short climb each lap)
I couldn't even jog at 142bpm so is the 5% rule just as flawed as 220-age etc.
I am heavy (about 100kg) so I guess running would require a lot more effort than cycling but should my zones be so different or do I just need to grow some and work harder on the bike?


I'll follow the responses on this too. My bike HR is much much lower than my run HR. I think for me it might be due to lack of bike specific fitness compared to my run fitness, i.e. my legs are a the limiting factor on the bike and my CV system is the limiting factor on the runs.


It's hard to measure bike effort and relate HR to it, in my experience. I started training to power in January and that has allowed me to learn what my HR is like at different effort levels.

If it encourages, my long ride and long runs are at similar average HRs ~ 155 for the run, 140 for the bike.


What's similar about these?


Similar to the OP?


Ah! Thanks...
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JaRok2300




Joined: 01 May 2014
Posts: 186
Location: Worcester, UK

PostPosted: Wed Apr 12, 2017 1:53 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Jorgan wrote:
Everyone is different, which is why these generic suggestions for HR can only go so far. It's why a lot of people now use power on the bike.

For example, my long easy run at 8min/miles would be at 120 bpm; can you keep it that low when you're out of bed Wink Very Happy


I think that corresponds to tying my laces before I go out, as long as I don't try and do them up too tight Sad

Out of curiosity, what would your equivalent long easy bike HR be?
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explorerJC




Joined: 20 Oct 2005
Posts: 14471
Location: Farthingstone

PostPosted: Wed Apr 12, 2017 2:50 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

JaRok2300 wrote:
Jorgan wrote:
Everyone is different, which is why these generic suggestions for HR can only go so far. It's why a lot of people now use power on the bike.

For example, my long easy run at 8min/miles would be at 120 bpm; can you keep it that low when you're out of bed Wink Very Happy


I think that corresponds to tying my laces before I go out, as long as I don't try and do them up too tight Sad

Out of curiosity, what would your equivalent long easy bike HR be?


but his HR max is 121 Smile
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iwaters




Joined: 06 Sep 2016
Posts: 252

PostPosted: Wed Apr 12, 2017 4:34 pm    Post subject: Re: Run v Bike HR Zones Reply with quote

JaRok2300 wrote:
I've never had a proper test but I'm fairly happy I've got my run HR zones about right. My long runs are around the 155-160 mark (85% by Fink zones) at @10min/mile and that feels relatively comfortable and sustainable.
According to Fink, bikes zones should be 5% lower and this is what feels way out. I did a couple of 4 mile intervals on the bike last night, not balls out but a pretty hard effort for about 12 minutes and my average HR was 142. (Max 160 on a short climb each lap)
I couldn't even jog at 142bpm so is the 5% rule just as flawed as 220-age etc.
I am heavy (about 100kg) so I guess running would require a lot more effort than cycling but should my zones be so different or do I just need to grow some and work harder on the bike?


I am the same weight as you. I don't look at HR when training as I use power/pace but I always wear an HR strap for analysis after.

My max HR as seen in a 5k/10k race is 190. My threshold given from training peaks is 175.

I find the same as you on long runs that will be about 155. On the bike I am closer to 140. At the weekend I did 2 hours upper Z2 power, with a couple of large hills (steep not long). My average HR was 142.

I have put it down to what you said about your size. You are always fighting your weight when running and I fatigue more quickly when running and so I guess me heart has to work a it harder.
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explorerJC




Joined: 20 Oct 2005
Posts: 14471
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PostPosted: Thu Apr 13, 2017 7:34 am    Post subject: Re: Run v Bike HR Zones Reply with quote

iwaters wrote:
JaRok2300 wrote:
I've never had a proper test but I'm fairly happy I've got my run HR zones about right. My long runs are around the 155-160 mark (85% by Fink zones) at @10min/mile and that feels relatively comfortable and sustainable.
According to Fink, bikes zones should be 5% lower and this is what feels way out. I did a couple of 4 mile intervals on the bike last night, not balls out but a pretty hard effort for about 12 minutes and my average HR was 142. (Max 160 on a short climb each lap)
I couldn't even jog at 142bpm so is the 5% rule just as flawed as 220-age etc.
I am heavy (about 100kg) so I guess running would require a lot more effort than cycling but should my zones be so different or do I just need to grow some and work harder on the bike?


I am the same weight as you. I don't look at HR when training as I use power/pace but I always wear an HR strap for analysis after.

My max HR as seen in a 5k/10k race is 190. My threshold given from training peaks is 175.

I find the same as you on long runs that will be about 155. On the bike I am closer to 140. At the weekend I did 2 hours upper Z2 power, with a couple of large hills (steep not long). My average HR was 142.

I have put it down to what you said about your size. You are always fighting your weight when running and I fatigue more quickly when running and so I guess me heart has to work a it harder.


it's not that you are fighting your weight, although of course I haven't seen you run Smile , but that the bike is carrying your mass when cycling
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Jorgan




Joined: 12 Nov 2007
Posts: 16215
Location: alles was ich bin, alles was ich war

PostPosted: Thu Apr 13, 2017 9:13 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

JaRok2300 wrote:
Jorgan wrote:
Everyone is different, which is why these generic suggestions for HR can only go so far. It's why a lot of people now use power on the bike.

For example, my long easy run at 8min/miles would be at 120 bpm; can you keep it that low when you're out of bed Wink Very Happy


I think that corresponds to tying my laces before I go out, as long as I don't try and do them up too tight Sad

Out of curiosity, what would your equivalent long easy bike HR be?


110-115. On decent hills when out of the saddle, it generally goes up to about 140-145. My VO2 efforts on the trainer tend to be the same (110-120% FTP @140-5). FTP HR is 135-140. Add 10 for the run. It's rare for me to ever go over 160 on the run these days; it hit 166 while back when I had a go at a Strava segment on a hill. I haven't done a laboratory VO2 Max test in over 20 years (MHR only 183 in 1994 aged 20) but I estimate Max is certainly no more than 175 these days. I have been doing endurance sports since age 12, so that probably has a bearing.
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Last edited by Jorgan on Thu Apr 13, 2017 9:18 am; edited 1 time in total
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mattsurf




Joined: 28 Sep 2016
Posts: 235
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PostPosted: Thu Apr 13, 2017 9:16 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Easy Ride: 14.5mph, 130w, 120bpm
Easy Run: 11m/mile, 120bpm

Mid effort Ride: 18mph, 180w, 150bpm
Mid effort Run: 7:40/mile, 150bpm

Hard Ride: 22.5mpg, 265w, 165bpm
Hard Run: 6:45/mile, 165bpm

Max HR 190bpm
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explorerJC




Joined: 20 Oct 2005
Posts: 14471
Location: Farthingstone

PostPosted: Thu Apr 13, 2017 10:45 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

mattsurf wrote:
Easy Ride: 14.5mph, 130w, 120bpm
Easy Run: 11m/mile, 120bpm

Mid effort Ride: 18mph, 180w, 150bpm
Mid effort Run: 7:40/mile, 150bpm

Hard Ride: 22.5mpg, 265w, 165bpm
Hard Run: 6:45/mile, 165bpm

Max HR 190bpm


that's worse than Mrs eJC's Porsche...
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