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Where are the TT bikes with Disc Brakes?
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jayski




Joined: 30 Jul 2018
Posts: 57

PostPosted: Mon Jul 30, 2018 11:15 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Jorgan wrote:
Sylvain Chavanel was riding a TT bike (Wilier) with disc brakes at the weekend. Deep rims though, as I think disc wheels with braking rotors are pretty rare, Zipp are the only ones I've seen.


FFWD make them too.

I have re-read this entire thread and there appears to be overwhelming weight of user based evidence on one side and one person shouting at the world on the other side.

Not getting into which is right or wrong...I will get shouted at Wink
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mattsurf




Joined: 28 Sep 2016
Posts: 641
Location: Zug, Switzerland

PostPosted: Tue Jul 31, 2018 11:00 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Why do we need TT Bikes with discs?

Simple real world example:
This weekend I did IM Zurich on my TT bike with carbon wheels. It was blazing hot, around 35 degrees. On Heart Break Hill, supporters had erected showers and were also spraying riders with water as they passed... it was lovely, however, after the top of the hill you go down a pretty technical descent. Coming down at 60kph+ I hit the brakes for a hard left hand corner: nothing, wet brakes, carbon rims, zero braking. Luckily the brakes did switch on after a couple of revolutions of the wheel, I briefly locked the rear, but somehow slithered my way inelegantly around the corner, just missing the traffic island.

Disc brakes only need to make a difference once


Last edited by mattsurf on Tue Jul 31, 2018 11:10 am; edited 1 time in total
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Jorgan




Joined: 12 Nov 2007
Posts: 17748
Location: alles was ich bin, alles was ich war

PostPosted: Tue Jul 31, 2018 11:06 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

jayski wrote:
Not getting into which is right or wrong...I will get shouted at Wink


Graham will be using his admin rights to see if it's one of us posting as a new login Very Happy
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SGreg




Joined: 30 Jun 2010
Posts: 1084
Location: High Peak

PostPosted: Tue Jul 31, 2018 12:08 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Doca wrote:
In IM Wales in September I would be faster if I had disc brakes because I would be able to go into the corners faster & carry more speed.



Not True!!! I am With GrahamO


Last September I did IM Wales with Carbon Rim Brakes. It rained solidly for about 5 hours on the bike.


I was MUCH faster than if I had disc brakes. Why?

My brakes were so utterly ineffective I was pretty much unable to slow down at all! All corners and hills were taken flat out as I had nothing to available to me to impact my speed!

All these mugs were braking into the bends, I simply turned in, closed my eyes, mumbled to the dark lord and waited for the ambulance. Fortunately, I made it out the other side of most of them. Unlike quite a few upturned riders I passed on the day waiting for treatment. Some pretty serious. I'm sure they all wished they had #@?# brakes like me.

Normally I would apply the brakes fully at the top and crawl down the hill to never let the bike get away from me knowing I couldn't slow down, but this was a race so none of that #@?#! Plus I have a big unjustified Ego, Nothing like GrahamO, who's Ego, while enormous, is clearly fully justified!

Honestly, I can not see any need whatsoever to brake more effectively.

And I'm sure Apples decision to drop the headphone socket had NOTHING to do with selling more expensive wireless headphones. It was a genuine need for thinner phones!

iPhone X - 7.7mm thick
iPhone 8 - 7.5mm thick
iPhone 6 - 6.9mm thick
Huawei P10 - 7mm thick

... erm
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jayski




Joined: 30 Jul 2018
Posts: 57

PostPosted: Tue Jul 31, 2018 12:14 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

mattsurf wrote:
Why do we need TT Bikes with discs?

Simple real world example:
This weekend I did IM Zurich on my TT bike with carbon wheels. It was blazing hot, around 35 degrees. On Heart Break Hill, supporters had erected showers and were also spraying riders with water as they passed... it was lovely, however, after the top of the hill you go down a pretty technical descent. Coming down at 60kph+ I hit the brakes for a hard left hand corner: nothing, wet brakes, carbon rims, zero braking. Luckily the brakes did switch on after a couple of revolutions of the wheel, I briefly locked the rear, but somehow slithered my way inelegantly around the corner, just missing the traffic island.

Disc brakes only need to make a difference once


Precisely, its the same with the helmet debate. People saying that they dont wear a helmet because they are a perfectly good cyclist - well maybe but it might not be your choice to have a car pull out in front of you, just like it wasnt your choice to be kindly soaked by the spectators.

Disc brakes perform better, overall, because they are reliable in all conditions in my experience. I now have 2 bikes with discs and I cannot see myself going back to rim brakes any time soon. A caveat though, I would always choose hydraulic discs...I struggle to see as much benefit in cable discs. I just have to wait for more choice when it comes to TT bikes, mind you, that Wilier Turbine is pretty special.
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Jorgan




Joined: 12 Nov 2007
Posts: 17748
Location: alles was ich bin, alles was ich war

PostPosted: Tue Jul 31, 2018 12:55 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

jayski wrote:
mind you, that Wilier Turbine is pretty pricey.


FTFY Very Happy
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jayski




Joined: 30 Jul 2018
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PostPosted: Tue Jul 31, 2018 1:54 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Jorgan wrote:
jayski wrote:
mind you, that Wilier Turbine is pretty pricey.


FTFY Very Happy


Well quite. At least it's better than that abysmal P5X with 100 brakes on a 15k bike.
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redbiker




Joined: 24 May 2004
Posts: 6074

PostPosted: Wed Aug 01, 2018 8:50 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Pretty sure we're going to see more disc brake TT bikes in 2019. Should find out around about the middle of August if Cervelo have anything new planned.

For what it's worth, Cervelo claim that the S3 Disc road bike is more aero than the S3 with rim brakes due to better air flow around the top of the fork. Their aero testing is very consistent (same wind tunnel, same rider model in same position on all bikes they made for at least the last 10 years). If I were purchasing for myself with ambitions of racing a hilly or technical Ironman (France or Wales for instance) it would be discs all the way. Rainy hairpin descents on carbon wheels? No thanks when there is a better alternative.
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SidSnot




Joined: 02 Sep 2005
Posts: 1636

PostPosted: Wed Aug 01, 2018 11:17 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

SGreg wrote:
Doca wrote:
In IM Wales in September I would be faster if I had disc brakes because I would be able to go into the corners faster & carry more speed.



Not True!!! I am With GrahamO


Last September I did IM Wales with Carbon Rim Brakes. It rained solidly for about 5 hours on the bike.


I was MUCH faster than if I had disc brakes. Why?

My brakes were so utterly ineffective I was pretty much unable to slow down at all! All corners and hills were taken flat out as I had nothing to available to me to impact my speed!

All these mugs were braking into the bends, I simply turned in, closed my eyes, mumbled to the dark lord and waited for the ambulance. Fortunately, I made it out the other side of most of them. Unlike quite a few upturned riders I passed on the day waiting for treatment. Some pretty serious. I'm sure they all wished they had #@?# brakes like me.

Normally I would apply the brakes fully at the top and crawl down the hill to never let the bike get away from me knowing I couldn't slow down, but this was a race so none of that #@?#! Plus I have a big unjustified Ego, Nothing like GrahamO, who's Ego, while enormous, is clearly fully justified!

Honestly, I can not see any need whatsoever to brake more effectively.

And I'm sure Apples decision to drop the headphone socket had NOTHING to do with selling more expensive wireless headphones. It was a genuine need for thinner phones!

iPhone X - 7.7mm thick
iPhone 8 - 7.5mm thick
iPhone 6 - 6.9mm thick
Huawei P10 - 7mm thick

... erm


I used the same approach at RideLondon at the weekend....I'm still alive
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