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Changing to a compact
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Foggo




Joined: 21 Aug 2003
Posts: 1503
Location: Kent

PostPosted: Wed May 10, 2017 9:17 am    Post subject: Changing to a compact Reply with quote

I'm off to the Alps for a week's cycling and looking to put a compact chainring on my bike.
Is there anything else I need to think about & change?
Obviously the cassette too - will an 11 speed fit n my 10 speed zipp 303s? I think it will wont it?
What about the chain & derailleur?
I'll probably swap the chain anyway when getting a new cassette but does the rear derailleur need swapping too?
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Doca




Joined: 27 Feb 2014
Posts: 109

PostPosted: Wed May 10, 2017 9:42 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

You don't need to change the cassette to run a compact chainset. A normal 11 speed cassette won't fit a 10 speed wheel but you can buy 'special' 11 speed cassettes to fit a 10 speed wheel. You would also need 11 speed shifters to match the cassette. I think the rear mech would be ok as long as you not going for more teeth on the largest sprocket on the cassette.

It would be easier for you to go compact and keep the 10 speed setup.
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jibberjim




Joined: 15 Aug 2008
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Location: Kingston

PostPosted: Wed May 10, 2017 9:45 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

all you need to do is change the rings or the entire chainset, depending on which chainset.

Nothing else at all is necessary - you won't even need to adjust the front derailleur if you're willing to take a slightly higher risk of the chain dropping.
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stenard




Joined: 04 Sep 2013
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PostPosted: Wed May 10, 2017 9:49 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

jibberjim wrote:
all you need to do is change the rings or the entire chainset, depending on which chainset.

Nothing else at all is necessary - you won't even need to adjust the front derailleur if you're willing to take a slightly higher risk of the chain dropping.

On the front mech point, it does depend. I put a compact on my TT for a hilly HIM at the end of last year, and I can't get in the smallest cogs on the rear whilst in 34T at the front without the chain rubbing the bottom of the front mech. It's apparently a known issue with my frameset and the SRAM Red front mech. It only properly works with a standard double somehow. The LBS tried for quite a while to get it to work smoothly in all ratios, but couldnt.

Quite manageable though - just have to switch to the big ring before I pass halfway on the cassette, which is no bad thing and I have an audible signal to prevent cross chaining even if I try.
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Jorgan




Joined: 12 Nov 2007
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PostPosted: Wed May 10, 2017 10:00 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Chain issues might depend on how 'slack' it is on his current set-up; if tension drops significantly when he moves to a Compact, then it might throw the chain on shifting to the inner ring.
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Foggo




Joined: 21 Aug 2003
Posts: 1503
Location: Kent

PostPosted: Wed May 10, 2017 2:33 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Thanks all. To be honest not really ridden a compact before but a number of people are advising one for a week in the Alps.
Any opinion on the right gearing for such a trip?
Also any view on bike set up & wheel choice?
Was planning on 303 clinchers
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Jgav




Joined: 06 Dec 2016
Posts: 203

PostPosted: Wed May 10, 2017 2:53 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Foggo wrote:
Thanks all. To be honest not really ridden a compact before but a number of people are advising one for a week in the Alps.
Any opinion on the right gearing for such a trip?
Also any view on bike set up & wheel choice?
Was planning on 303 clinchers


Depends how good you are going uphill. Go with a compact if you can, that should give you some lower range gears to help out. Cassettes come in some huge ratios (you can get an Ultegra 10 speed with a 30 on it, I don't think 10 speed goes bigger than that) but as I said, depends how much you need them.
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Tahr




Joined: 12 Feb 2015
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Location: South West Scotland

PostPosted: Thu May 11, 2017 2:54 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

For the Fred Whitton I used a compact and a 11-32 rear cassette in 10 speed, no problems some riders had MTB 11-34 and 11-36 on the back.
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jibberjim




Joined: 15 Aug 2008
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PostPosted: Thu May 11, 2017 3:08 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Jgav wrote:
Go with a compact if you can, that should give you some lower range gears to help out.


It's not even just about the absolute lowest gear, it's about having close ratios, so you're not stuck between a gear.

Spending more time where you choice is between 34x15 34x16 34x17 is better than choosing between 39x17 39x19 39x21, simply because you need to sacrifice the 19/21 etc. if you need to lower gears. The 34 means you'll be more likely to find the right gear for you that matches the cadence/force you want to produce.
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Foggo




Joined: 21 Aug 2003
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PostPosted: Tue May 23, 2017 11:31 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

jibberjim wrote:
Jgav wrote:
Go with a compact if you can, that should give you some lower range gears to help out.


It's not even just about the absolute lowest gear, it's about having close ratios, so you're not stuck between a gear.

Spending more time where you choice is between 34x15 34x16 34x17 is better than choosing between 39x17 39x19 39x21, simply because you need to sacrifice the 19/21 etc. if you need to lower gears. The 34 means you'll be more likely to find the right gear for you that matches the cadence/force you want to produce.


Currently I have a 10 speed set up, if I changed to a compact & an 11 speed cassette at the back would I need to change my shifters or would they work? They're Ultegra 10 speed.
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Jgav




Joined: 06 Dec 2016
Posts: 203

PostPosted: Tue May 23, 2017 12:29 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Foggo wrote:
jibberjim wrote:
Jgav wrote:
Go with a compact if you can, that should give you some lower range gears to help out.


It's not even just about the absolute lowest gear, it's about having close ratios, so you're not stuck between a gear.

Spending more time where you choice is between 34x15 34x16 34x17 is better than choosing between 39x17 39x19 39x21, simply because you need to sacrifice the 19/21 etc. if you need to lower gears. The 34 means you'll be more likely to find the right gear for you that matches the cadence/force you want to produce.


Currently I have a 10 speed set up, if I changed to a compact & an 11 speed cassette at the back would I need to change my shifters or would they work? They're Ultegra 10 speed.


Pretty sure you'll need to change the right shifter as well, it uses a different pull ratio. You would need a new cassette (obviously), new chain and a new rear mech. Shouldn't need to touch the front mech and left shifter.
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explorerJC




Joined: 20 Oct 2005
Posts: 14707
Location: Farthingstone

PostPosted: Tue May 23, 2017 1:16 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

stenard wrote:
jibberjim wrote:
all you need to do is change the rings or the entire chainset, depending on which chainset.

Nothing else at all is necessary - you won't even need to adjust the front derailleur if you're willing to take a slightly higher risk of the chain dropping.

On the front mech point, it does depend. I put a compact on my TT for a hilly HIM at the end of last year, and I can't get in the smallest cogs on the rear whilst in 34T at the front without the chain rubbing the bottom of the front mech. It's apparently a known issue with my frameset and the SRAM Red front mech. It only properly works with a standard double somehow. The LBS tried for quite a while to get it to work smoothly in all ratios, but couldnt.

Quite manageable though - just have to switch to the big ring before I pass halfway on the cassette, which is no bad thing and I have an audible signal to prevent cross chaining even if I try.


why did you need to be in that gear? you found the solution by changing gears the way it was designed to work
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Whisk




Joined: 09 Jun 2005
Posts: 8436
Location: London

PostPosted: Tue May 23, 2017 3:58 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Jgav wrote:
Foggo wrote:
jibberjim wrote:
Jgav wrote:
Go with a compact if you can, that should give you some lower range gears to help out.


It's not even just about the absolute lowest gear, it's about having close ratios, so you're not stuck between a gear.

Spending more time where you choice is between 34x15 34x16 34x17 is better than choosing between 39x17 39x19 39x21, simply because you need to sacrifice the 19/21 etc. if you need to lower gears. The 34 means you'll be more likely to find the right gear for you that matches the cadence/force you want to produce.


Currently I have a 10 speed set up, if I changed to a compact & an 11 speed cassette at the back would I need to change my shifters or would they work? They're Ultegra 10 speed.


Pretty sure you'll need to change the right shifter as well, it uses a different pull ratio. You would need a new cassette (obviously), new chain and a new rear mech. Shouldn't need to touch the front mech and left shifter.


If you're buying new then you have to buy levers in pairs. They don't sell them individually.

If you're going the eBay route then you might be able to pick up a single lever if someone has had to buy a par for a crash replacement when they only needed a single lever.
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kevb




Joined: 11 Aug 2010
Posts: 768

PostPosted: Tue May 23, 2017 10:10 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Foggo wrote:


Currently I have a 10 speed set up, if I changed to a compact & an 11 speed cassette at the back would I need to change my shifters or would they work? They're Ultegra 10 speed.


Definately new shifters to go to 11-speed, I tried it with a 10-speed dura-ace rear mech and didn't work with 105 11-speed shifters.

Just built up my TT bike with a 50-36 front chainset and 12-28 10-speed cassette. I don't like the big step of a 50-34, and have made up the cassette from a combination of HG 10-speeds I had lying about. Gives me a very close ratio mid range with a few bail-out gears 'just in case'!
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Jgav




Joined: 06 Dec 2016
Posts: 203

PostPosted: Wed May 24, 2017 10:08 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Whisk wrote:
Jgav wrote:
Foggo wrote:
jibberjim wrote:
Jgav wrote:
Go with a compact if you can, that should give you some lower range gears to help out.


It's not even just about the absolute lowest gear, it's about having close ratios, so you're not stuck between a gear.

Spending more time where you choice is between 34x15 34x16 34x17 is better than choosing between 39x17 39x19 39x21, simply because you need to sacrifice the 19/21 etc. if you need to lower gears. The 34 means you'll be more likely to find the right gear for you that matches the cadence/force you want to produce.


Currently I have a 10 speed set up, if I changed to a compact & an 11 speed cassette at the back would I need to change my shifters or would they work? They're Ultegra 10 speed.


Pretty sure you'll need to change the right shifter as well, it uses a different pull ratio. You would need a new cassette (obviously), new chain and a new rear mech. Shouldn't need to touch the front mech and left shifter.


If you're buying new then you have to buy levers in pairs. They don't sell them individually.

If you're going the eBay route then you might be able to pick up a single lever if someone has had to buy a par for a crash replacement when they only needed a single lever.


I didn't suggest that you can easily buy a single lever, only that you don't need to change the left one. Ebay may have something but it is unlikely to find a single.
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