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Killer cyclist on trial for manslaughter
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tuckandgo




Joined: 03 Sep 2012
Posts: 307

PostPosted: Mon Aug 21, 2017 12:27 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Jorgan wrote:
I wonder how many of the pro peloton cut about on fixies on the road. What you need to go with your fixed gear is a set of 'Power Cranks' Laughing

https://www.powercranks.com/



What on earth are those'?! If I have read it right........
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Jorgan




Joined: 12 Nov 2007
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PostPosted: Mon Aug 21, 2017 1:16 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

tuckandgo wrote:
Jorgan wrote:
I wonder how many of the pro peloton cut about on fixies on the road. What you need to go with your fixed gear is a set of 'Power Cranks' Laughing

https://www.powercranks.com/



What on earth are those'?! If I have read it right........


I believe they have 'mythical' status on ST Very Happy

Basically unless you have a perfectly smooth & 50/50 stroke, they lock-out as the arms work independently.
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explorerJC




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PostPosted: Mon Aug 21, 2017 1:24 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

nothing wrong with getting those hamstrings working on the bike...
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Tony Stark




Joined: 26 Apr 2007
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PostPosted: Mon Aug 21, 2017 6:32 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Regardless of what is safe or not, the law requires a fitted front brake,and he didn't have one, so that will probably be taken into account, even though the pedestrian clearly seems to have acted like a lemming.
He would need to spend a lot on expert witnesses to prove that a coaster brake or fixed wheel braking is as effective at stopping as a dual-brake setup, even though in reality stopping distance is affected by a huge number of factors such as brake type, tyre size and composition, speed, road surface and weather conditions, brake effectiveness and efficiency, temperature etc. etc.

Argument is already creeping into this case that he was somehow reckless by not wearing a helmet and no working bell fitted, even though the law does not require either of those things. It would be nice to see some of the cycling advocacy groups supporting him a bit more if only to seek clarity on the law. Otherwise, expect similar treatment if you are hit at night and do not have those items, as well as front and rear reflectors, pedal and wheel reflectors fitted, lights that are BS or E-marked etc. - not all of these are mandatory in use, but some are required at time of commercial (retail) sale depending on the bike type and assembly status of the bike.

As a side note, with dark nights approaching Crying or Very sad , recent scientific studies seem to support the (blatantly obvious?) idea that reflective clothing and lights/reflectors which oscillate with motion (i.e. wheel reflectors, lower leg or pedal/crank reflectors/lights) are hugely beneficial in drawing significant attention to riders, compared with fixed lights, even if they are flashing or pulsing. As a cyclist and motorbike commuter I prefer to be proactive in the visibility stakes, rather than argue after the event from my hospital bed that my tiny back light was fully legal. Things like reflective rim tape and spokeys, LED valve caps etc. cost pennies and weigh grams, but so many riders don't seem to consider them.
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tuckandgo




Joined: 03 Sep 2012
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PostPosted: Mon Aug 21, 2017 7:41 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Worth keeping an eye on this for a comment.

https://twitter.com/MartinPorter6

he's a QC who happens to be a roadie.
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SGreg




Joined: 30 Jun 2010
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PostPosted: Tue Aug 22, 2017 8:10 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Tony Stark wrote:

Argument is already creeping into this case that he was somehow reckless by not wearing a helmet and no working bell fitted, even though the law does not require either of those things.


Jesus! It really shows how over zealous they are being.

He has stated and its been witnessed he screamed for her to get out of the way....how would a bell have helped?


I'm way to much of a pussy about riding to even think about going out when its dark. Not much chance of getting knocked off the turbo.
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JamieMcP




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PostPosted: Tue Aug 22, 2017 8:35 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I have been riding a fixie to commute for about 10 years, it has front and back brakes, still on the original set of pads.
Just as some people who drive cars act like dicks so do some people who ride bikes
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stenard




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PostPosted: Tue Aug 22, 2017 8:54 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

tuckandgo wrote:
Worth keeping an eye on this for a comment.

https://twitter.com/MartinPorter6

he's a QC who happens to be a roadie.

Interesting he has retweeted this article: https://rdrf.org.uk/2017/08/21/the-charlie-alliston-case-the-real-story/

Without saying so himself, it's fairly clear what he thinks of this case (although that remains to be seen in the Guardian article he has hinted will be released post-verdict). A manslaughter charge in the context of what drivers get charged with does appear to be completely inequitable.
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explorerJC




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PostPosted: Tue Aug 22, 2017 9:18 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

stenard wrote:
tuckandgo wrote:
Worth keeping an eye on this for a comment.

https://twitter.com/MartinPorter6

he's a QC who happens to be a roadie.

Interesting he has retweeted this article: https://rdrf.org.uk/2017/08/21/the-charlie-alliston-case-the-real-story/

Without saying so himself, it's fairly clear what he thinks of this case (although that remains to be seen in the Guardian article he has hinted will be released post-verdict). A manslaughter charge in the context of what drivers get charged with does appear to be completely inequitable.


i was surprised how many bikes are involved in pedestrian fatalities...
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Jorgan




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PostPosted: Wed Aug 23, 2017 10:07 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

When you are suddenly presented with an obstacle/hazard in the road, what's the very first reaction, to brake or to swerve? If the cyclist had died and the pedestrian who stepped out in front of them lived, would there be a case to answer, and what for?

Perhaps all cycle frames that do not come with mounts for either rim or disc brakes should have a (permanent) warning on them that they are not legal on public roads in the UK; not watertight, but what is.
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SidSnot




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PostPosted: Wed Aug 23, 2017 10:22 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Jorgan wrote:
When you are suddenly presented with an obstacle/hazard in the road, what's the very first reaction, to brake or to swerve? If the cyclist had died and the pedestrian who stepped out in front of them lived, would there be a case to answer, and what for?

Perhaps all cycle frames that do not come with mounts for either rim or disc brakes should have a (permanent) warning on them that they are not legal on public roads in the UK; not watertight, but what is.


Good questions, I would imagine not
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Whisk




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PostPosted: Wed Aug 23, 2017 10:27 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

It said in one of the reports that the accident investigator who stated that the cyclist would have been able to stop in time if he'd had brakes fitted did his test using a mountain bike. Leaving aside the different reaction times if you know you're going to have to stop in the test, you're hardly comparing like with like here Rolling Eyes

I believe the cyclist swerved to the left and the pedestrian stepped back into his path at the last minute.
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Jorgan




Joined: 12 Nov 2007
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PostPosted: Wed Aug 23, 2017 10:34 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Whisk wrote:

I believe the cyclist swerved to the left and the pedestrian stepped back into his path at the last minute.


I'd have thought there were a fair few eye witnesses who would confirm the circumstances.
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Whisk




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PostPosted: Wed Aug 23, 2017 11:25 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Jorgan wrote:
Whisk wrote:

I believe the cyclist swerved to the left and the pedestrian stepped back into his path at the last minute.


I'd have thought there were a fair few eye witnesses who would confirm the circumstances.


I think it was all captured on CCTV.

There seem to be some pretty specific speeds being thrown around, so unless the ride was being recorded on Garmin/Strava, I guess they probably used the TV footage to determine the speed.
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Jorgan




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PostPosted: Wed Aug 23, 2017 12:47 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

How long has the Jury been deliberating, since Monday? I would be very surprised if he was found guilty of manslaughter; the lesser charge could be what they're trying to agree on. I guess we'll found out at some point this week.
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