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SloggingScotsman




Joined: 18 Jul 2006
Posts: 2639

PostPosted: Thu Sep 21, 2017 6:26 am    Post subject: Britain Reply with quote

Did No one really turn up at the UN to hear Teresa Mays speech except for Boris Johnson!

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/politics/theresa-may-united-nations-donald-trump-new-york-speech-a7958326.html

Speaks volumes about what other nations think of Britain. Mind you the recent UN report on the disgraceful way Cameron to May are treating our disabled people probably didn't help.

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/home-news/un-disabled-rights-uk-government-denounced-criticised-united-nations-austerity-policies-a7923006.html

While our politicians play at politics our country is dividing over Brexit, real fear has been installed into millions, and now no one at the UN wants to hear what we say.

Might be a lesson or two in there.
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explorerJC




Joined: 20 Oct 2005
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PostPosted: Thu Sep 21, 2017 7:59 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

that probably says about as much about the UN as it does May and or Britain...

i am sure that the threat of a democratic nation emerging once more does cause them some concern...
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Jorgan




Joined: 12 Nov 2007
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PostPosted: Thu Sep 21, 2017 9:52 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Time will tell, and none of us have a crystal ball, despite what some politicians claim.

But it's a fact that the weakness of the pound is as a direct result of the Referendum, wiping billions off UK companies and making your pint of beer on holiday noticeably more expensive.
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explorerJC




Joined: 20 Oct 2005
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PostPosted: Thu Sep 21, 2017 10:08 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Jorgan wrote:
Time will tell, and none of us have a crystal ball, despite what some politicians claim.

But it's a fact that the weakness of the pound is as a direct result of the Referendum, wiping billions off UK companies and making your pint of beer on holiday noticeably more expensive.


the fact that the EU ties its member nations in such knots of complexity and makes in almost impossible to leave makes it a club i'd rather not have joined in the first place...but we didn't get a say on that...

There are certainly dark days ahead and it will hurt uk business and thus the population) for a long time to come...however, firstly we shouldn't have got stuck in this mess in the first place and secondly, it would probably only have got harder in the future and thus it is best to get out now...
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SloggingScotsman




Joined: 18 Jul 2006
Posts: 2639

PostPosted: Thu Sep 21, 2017 11:20 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

explorerJC wrote:
it would probably only have got harder in the future and thus it is best to get out now...
I am not so sure ejc.

Consider:-

1. Globally. The UK as evidenced by the fact that no other country in the world came to listen to Mays speech, is rapidly becoming a has been. Our influence is obviously worth squat now.

2. Regionally. The EU have clearly had enough of us and all of this playing politics to advance careers and keep parties together, has ruined our current and potential future influence in the medium term in Europe.

3. Nationally. Brexit is still ripping the country apart, and with what is happening in the polls, combined with welfare changes hitting now and their effects on people, it is highly likely that the ‘Profumo moment’ of the election is now proceeding into the Conservative Party repeating history and may well collapse through internal exhaustion and public pressure before 5 years are up. I mean Corbyn is polling better than May still.

4. Individually, with the final push re welfare changes that is coming live now, over the next year or so there will be a lot more homeless, food bank use, and even second hand more people will ask ‘did aunty Jenny really deserve this?’ Don’t underestimate the likely British ‘doing the right thing’ kickback from this in a couple of years time.

All in all Ejc, we are placing our country in a very difficult place, with internal unease at what is right and proper, our powers that be realising that they have lost their clout globally, and someone, most likely Corbyn is going to pick all the pieces up, with those implications.

At least had we stayed in the EU we would have had a say, and would have been listened to. Now we are rapidly becoming irrelevant.


I forewarned, as always I got ignored.
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Jorgan




Joined: 12 Nov 2007
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PostPosted: Thu Sep 21, 2017 11:27 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

SloggingScotsman wrote:

I forewarned, as always I got ignored.


People considerably more prominent than you did the same, so don't be hard on yourself Saint Sloggers Wink

The trouble is that no-one knows who to really believe nowadays, as there are conspiracy/establishment/greed arguments on both sides.
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SloggingScotsman




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PostPosted: Thu Sep 21, 2017 11:34 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Jorgan wrote:
SloggingScotsman wrote:

I forewarned, as always I got ignored.


People considerably more prominent than you did the same, so don't be hard on yourself Saint Sloggers Wink
Twisted Evil

My career path to General Secretary of the UN.......


1. Some rich geezer leave me billions in his will.
2. I spend a decade doing my own thing touring the world skilling up.
3. In a decade once the Conservatives realise that they are irrelevant again, I rejoin my old party and help them regain power, but in a more balanced manner.
4. This success in helping the party results in my name going forward to help the EU (who knows how from the outside) balance the crisis that will develop by then when America realises that it is playing second fiddle to China.
5. After sorting that lot out I get chosen for SG and I enable intergalactic trade, resulting in vast wealth, peace, and opportunities for all, while ensuring a balanced safe world here.
6. In thirty years time, on my deathbed I reflect ‘that was fun’.


Sorted.


Back in the real world, IFRSs call.


Last edited by SloggingScotsman on Thu Sep 21, 2017 11:39 am; edited 3 times in total
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Tin Pot




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PostPosted: Thu Sep 21, 2017 11:34 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

explorerJC wrote:
that probably says about as much about the UN as it does May and or Britain...

i am sure that the threat of a democratic nation emerging once more does cause them some concern...


We turn up to say we'd like reform in return for the $xBillion we give them, and they don't even bother to turn up to hear us?

I'd be cancelling the cheque on the flight home.
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Whisk




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PostPosted: Thu Sep 21, 2017 11:38 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

In the information age, is it really important who turns up in person to witness a speech? Unless it's someone with obvious crazy entertainment value like Trump, you might as well watch it on catch-up or read the abridged transcript afterwards Wink
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explorerJC




Joined: 20 Oct 2005
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PostPosted: Thu Sep 21, 2017 11:53 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

SloggingScotsman wrote:
explorerJC wrote:
it would probably only have got harder in the future and thus it is best to get out now...
I am not so sure ejc.

Consider:-

1. Globally. The UK as evidenced by the fact that no other country in the world came to listen to Mays speech, is rapidly becoming a has been. Our influence is obviously worth squat now.

2. Regionally. The EU have clearly had enough of us and all of this playing politics to advance careers and keep parties together, has ruined our current and potential future influence in the medium term in Europe.

3. Nationally. Brexit is still ripping the country apart, and with what is happening in the polls, combined with welfare changes hitting now and their effects on people, it is highly likely that the ‘Profumo moment’ of the election is now proceeding into the Conservative Party repeating history and may well collapse through internal exhaustion and public pressure before 5 years are up. I mean Corbyn is polling better than May still.

4. Individually, with the final push re welfare changes that is coming live now, over the next year or so there will be a lot more homeless, food bank use, and even second hand more people will ask ‘did aunty Jenny really deserve this?’ Don’t underestimate the likely British ‘doing the right thing’ kickback from this in a couple of years time.

All in all Ejc, we are placing our country in a very difficult place, with internal unease at what is right and proper, our powers that be realising that they have lost their clout globally, and someone, most likely Corbyn is going to pick all the pieces up, with those implications.

At least had we stayed in the EU we would have had a say, and would have been listened to. Now we are rapidly becoming irrelevant.


I forewarned, as always I got ignored.


What i liked most about the referendum result was that the public told the politicians and big business to fek off. I also liked the fact that the youth, thinking they were being rebellious, were actually being conservative...i love irony Smile

What spoils your argument, apart from your flawed understanding of the EU, is that you then mix in a moral argument about welfare. Now obviously welfare is important, but the mixture suggests that the EU argument is a matter of right and wrong and/or that the combination of the EU and welfare may be the tipping point. In the first case, i am pretty sure you may be wrong and in the second you may well be right. However, it is worth noting that had we remained in the EU, our welfare problems may well have continued to increase considerably.

What bothers me most about your argument is that the referendum may well be splitting the country, however, firstly please remember the way the nation voted and secondly, please remember that had the referendum not taken place then over half the people who chose to have an interest in this conundrum were unhappy with the direction the EU was going.

So, it was not the referendum that split the country it was our inability to manage the EU appropriately and the EU's inability (or more likely, lack of interest) to take the warnings on board. Don't forget, both you and the EU were forewarned and you chose to ignore those warnings.

As for Britain losing its voice in the world? I am pretty cool with that. Democracy is really far more important than the posturing you sometimes dislike and sometimes seem to feel is important for the nation. The only countries that i know of that really dislike our format of democracy with all its flaws tend to be police states and autocratic federations.
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SloggingScotsman




Joined: 18 Jul 2006
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PostPosted: Thu Sep 21, 2017 12:14 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Ejc

Fair comment
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explorerJC




Joined: 20 Oct 2005
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Location: Farthingstone

PostPosted: Thu Sep 21, 2017 12:47 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Tin Pot wrote:
explorerJC wrote:
that probably says about as much about the UN as it does May and or Britain...

i am sure that the threat of a democratic nation emerging once more does cause them some concern...


We turn up to say we'd like reform in return for the $xBillion we give them, and they don't even bother to turn up to hear us?

I'd be cancelling the cheque on the flight home.


Another case of Fat Buddha's only reading the headline...but i glanced at the headline in The Times and it said "May tells the UN that it is failing us" ...and for once, I agree with her...

the problem with cancelling the cheque would be all the legacy payments of fat pensions and housing etc...that we'd have to pay out...a bit like the EU
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SloggingScotsman




Joined: 18 Jul 2006
Posts: 2639

PostPosted: Thu Sep 21, 2017 7:29 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Jorgan wrote:
SloggingScotsman wrote:

I forewarned, as always I got ignored.


The trouble is that no-one knows who to really believe nowadays, as there are conspiracy/establishment/greed arguments on both sides.
Indeed there are.

While I am a nobody I do have two advantages over most:-

1. I have had two decades of time to think and reflect and learn about lots of different things, which does help with lateral thinking.

2. I do genuinely look at things from a global perspective. Not through choice so much as just the way my mind works. Hence why I look at the effects of an issue at several different levels, from individuals to super-national. Objectively.

Having made the conscious decision to work my way out of darkness two decades ago (life was so poopy that I literally woke up one day and said there must be more than this to life). You could say I prayed for understanding, and it came, after huge amounts of reflective work.

Do I expect anyone to believe me? No not really after all I have been laughed at for years. But anyone who has the ability to scroll back through the past thirty years of my life will see me be correct against conventional wisdom several times.

Pity I am not in the 0.00001% for I could then do immense amounts of good things to help rebalance. Money after all does talk. Perhaps I am a wannabe beauty queen wanting to bring world peace!
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Tony Stark




Joined: 26 Apr 2007
Posts: 2441
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PostPosted: Thu Sep 21, 2017 9:19 pm    Post subject: Re: Britain Reply with quote

SloggingScotsman wrote:
Did No one really turn up at the UN to hear Teresa Mays speech except for Boris Johnson!


Theresa, Teresa, I think we have been here before....
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explorerJC




Joined: 20 Oct 2005
Posts: 14790
Location: Farthingstone

PostPosted: Thu Sep 21, 2017 9:58 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

SloggingScotsman wrote:
Jorgan wrote:
SloggingScotsman wrote:

I forewarned, as always I got ignored.


The trouble is that no-one knows who to really believe nowadays, as there are conspiracy/establishment/greed arguments on both sides.
Indeed there are.

While I am a nobody I do have two advantages over most:-

1. I have had two decades of time to think and reflect and learn about lots of different things, which does help with lateral thinking.

2. I do genuinely look at things from a global perspective. Not through choice so much as just the way my mind works. Hence why I look at the effects of an issue at several different levels, from individuals to super-national. Objectively.

Having made the conscious decision to work my way out of darkness two decades ago (life was so poopy that I literally woke up one day and said there must be more than this to life). You could say I prayed for understanding, and it came, after huge amounts of reflective work.

Do I expect anyone to believe me? No not really after all I have been laughed at for years. But anyone who has the ability to scroll back through the past thirty years of my life will see me be correct against conventional wisdom several times.

Pity I am not in the 0.00001% for I could then do immense amounts of good things to help rebalance. Money after all does talk. Perhaps I am a wannabe beauty queen wanting to bring world peace!


how do you think of anything objectively?
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