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Road hydro disc, real world experience.
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FatPom




Joined: 26 Dec 2005
Posts: 5197
Location: My happy place

PostPosted: Sat Oct 14, 2017 9:38 am    Post subject: Road hydro disc, real world experience. Reply with quote

After 15 yrs faithful service and relentless crit racing and training abuse, my Ti frame has finally given up ( ironically, it's one of the non Ti parts that is failing).

So, choices are, rebuild another frameset using existing parts ( 2012 11sp Chorus), or finally make the leap to a dics brake bike. My regular roadie and TT bike will stay at home so this is a bike to keep at my Mum's house in Somt and will cover all non racing duties down there.

There are a few bargains around at the moment and a couple of them have Shimano 105 hydro discs fitted . (can't believe I'm typing Shimano after 30 odd years on Campag but hey ho).

This bike will exist in its own environment, so considerations like wheel swapping and car roof rack compatibility don't come into play. I am interested in hearing about the real world faff with squealing, disc contamination, disc warping etc. I build all my bikes from scratch usually, so need to get my head around tools and requirements.

Not interested in a 'don't need 'em debate, so stow that. Wink
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undies




Joined: 14 Aug 2004
Posts: 172
Location: Eastbourne

PostPosted: Sat Oct 14, 2017 9:49 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I’ve been commuting (pretty much every working day, all weathers) on the shimano 785 brakes for nearly 4 years I think🤔. Useful, consistent, controllable braking is incredible. In the wet you’re slowing when all Tim brakes are doing is grating!
Maintenance is very simple with Shimano, only needing £10 of ‘tools’ you probably don’t have. I run shimano ice-tech 160 rotors, which I’ve replaced once and resin pads which I’ve replaced just over once per year. There’s a bit of howling when they first get wet, but that goes as they getter wetter on wet days, or if you get cleaner on them.
They’re not as ‘pretty’, but they are functionally brilliant. No cable drag or sticking, and very light at the lever. I have Dura ace and Record rim brakes, so I know what good rim brakes are like.
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FatPom




Joined: 26 Dec 2005
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PostPosted: Sun Oct 15, 2017 2:40 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

cheers mate Cool
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tin pot




Joined: 08 Jul 2013
Posts: 2563
Location: Bromley

PostPosted: Sun Oct 15, 2017 7:19 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I'm pondering something similar - so far I'm between TRP Spyre and BB7.

I don't think there's much in it performance wise, but my concern is maintenance and on the road recovery so I'm edging towards Spyre.
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JeffB




Joined: 04 May 2008
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Location: Middlesbrough

PostPosted: Sun Oct 15, 2017 8:37 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Got the 105 ones on my Enigma, excellent but can be a shock going back to rim brakes on the other bikes.

They are two years old and they've had two winters use, the front one has started squealing a bit so I need to get it sorted.

I do regularly take the wheels off to put it in the back of the car though.

I have occasionally locked the back wheel, especially when it is greasy.

Jeff
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JeffB




Joined: 04 May 2008
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Location: Middlesbrough

PostPosted: Sun Oct 15, 2017 9:13 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Should say I've never had to do any maintenance so not sure if it is a PITA or not, all the mountain bikers I know say it is a doddle.

Jeff
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Jorgan




Joined: 12 Nov 2007
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Location: alles was ich bin, alles was ich war

PostPosted: Mon Oct 16, 2017 8:16 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

My new Canyon has Hydro brakes. Apart from it arriving with a warped front rotor (new one sent out immediately), they have worked very well. I was down on my knees for about 30 min trying to eliminate all rub, as the clearances are tight, but sorted now. I even managed to swap the levers back to the 'Euro' configuration easily (after shipping), as the brake lines have the junctions on them. With 28mm tyres too, having hydro discs makes descending pretty awesome in my experience. Maybe it's because I've been riding a TT bike all summer with carbon rims Laughing

Discs are the future, like it or not. At least now they're starting to pour the effort & technology into it on the road side. Even mainstream TT bikes are going to have discs in the next few years, once they've sold-off all the rim stuff. For me, disc brakes offer more performance advantage than electronic shifting, if you're having to choose between the two.
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FatPom




Joined: 26 Dec 2005
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PostPosted: Mon Oct 16, 2017 8:27 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Jorgan wrote:
My new Canyon has Hydro brakes. Apart from it arriving with a warped front rotor (new one sent out immediately), they have worked very well. I was down on my knees for about 30 min trying to eliminate all rub, as the clearances are tight, but sorted now. I even managed to swap the levers back to the 'Euro' configuration easily (after shipping), as the brake lines have the junctions on them. With 28mm tyres too, having hydro discs makes descending pretty awesome in my experience. Maybe it's because I've been riding a TT bike all summer with carbon rims Laughing

Discs are the future, like it or not. At least now they're starting to pour the effort & technology into it on the road side. Even mainstream TT bikes are going to have discs in the next few years, once they've sold-off all the rim stuff. For me, disc brakes offer more performance advantage than electronic shifting, if you're having to choose between the two.


Cheers. Descending and handling aren't issue for me (years of racing moto) plus I also spent summer on the cow crap covered lanes of Somt on the P3 with 404s, so if I survived that and IM Wales, I should be good. Very Happy

I don't think I'd ever like to be without a rim brake as I still dabble in crits and RR now and then . (maybe BC will follow CA's lead and allow discs for club racing).

Setting them up should be OK but I'm more familiar with brembo 4 pot and fully floating discs.

So what are the 'essentials', a Park Tool rotor tool, a bleed kit and pad spacer? This bike will be at Mum's so I won't have all the bits I have at home.

When you clean the bike, is it wheels removed to avoid contamination? I think this is my biggest concern, the extra faff for essentially what is a very part time bike.
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FatPom




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PostPosted: Mon Oct 16, 2017 9:49 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Forgot to add. Initially I wanted to keep it around £1500 but also looking at 105 Cervelo C3 or a Synapse. The 2017 Synapse disc has thru axles only on the front and an alloy seatpost. The new Synapse has thru axles both ends, carbon post and bar ( I think) but it's £600 more.

I wouldn't consider a cannondale at all with the stupid pf30A but now you can get a CBear adaptor I'm not so bothered. I fitted a Praxis for Campag on my Bianchi and have been very happy and creak free.

Rim brake 2018 Synapse runs to £1500 but I think there are older frames slapped together to run out stock.
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Jorgan




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PostPosted: Mon Oct 16, 2017 1:52 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Just watch for some bikes that have 15mm thru axle front, but 12mm rear; not ideal imo. Canyon 2x12mm axle.
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FatPom




Joined: 26 Dec 2005
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PostPosted: Mon Oct 16, 2017 2:50 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Jorgan wrote:
Just watch for some bikes that have 15mm thru axle front, but 12mm rear; not ideal imo. Canyon 2x12mm axle.


Yeah I was reading about that. I know the Cervelo has 2 x 12 and I'm pretty sure the new Synapse does also but will check.
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Jorgan




Joined: 12 Nov 2007
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PostPosted: Mon Oct 16, 2017 3:20 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

FatPom wrote:
Jorgan wrote:
Just watch for some bikes that have 15mm thru axle front, but 12mm rear; not ideal imo. Canyon 2x12mm axle.


Yeah I was reading about that. I know the Cervelo has 2 x 12 and I'm pretty sure the new Synapse does also but will check.


The 2018 Synapse is a nice looking bike; most of the colours are really non-descript though (read boring). I've seen the 105 version which is Navy Blue with yellow decals & detailing, that was nice.
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FatPom




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PostPosted: Mon Oct 16, 2017 4:01 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Jorgan wrote:
FatPom wrote:
Jorgan wrote:
Just watch for some bikes that have 15mm thru axle front, but 12mm rear; not ideal imo. Canyon 2x12mm axle.


Yeah I was reading about that. I know the Cervelo has 2 x 12 and I'm pretty sure the new Synapse does also but will check.


The 2018 Synapse is a nice looking bike; most of the colours are really non-descript though (read boring). I've seen the 105 version which is Navy Blue with yellow decals & detailing, that was nice.


Yeah that's the one I have in mind if I go that wat but tbh, at £100 more than the C3, quality wise my money would be on the Cervelo.

To me the new Synapse does look a bit less like a horse than the previous version.

I think it will come down between rim Synapse or Cervelo C3.
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FatPom




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PostPosted: Tue Oct 17, 2017 12:16 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

The more I'm reading about the Synapse disc frame, the more I'm liking tbh.
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kevb




Joined: 11 Aug 2010
Posts: 786

PostPosted: Tue Oct 17, 2017 5:49 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Tin Pot wrote:
I'm pondering something similar - so far I'm between TRP Spyre and BB7.

I don't think there's much in it performance wise, but my concern is maintenance and on the road recovery so I'm edging towards Spyre.


Just had a set of these delivered, about £40 including delivery (no import costs luckily Cool )

https://www.aliexpress.com/item/Bicycle-Disc-Brake-Set-Kit-Bike-Rotor-with-Bolts-Wheel-Brake-Front-Rear-Wheel-Brake-160mm/32723296860.html?spm=2114.search0104.3.12.L6J7lq&ws_ab_test=searchweb0_0,searchweb201602_2_10152_10065_10151_10130_10068_10344_10345_10342_10343_10340_10341_10192_10190_10307_10301_10303_10060_10155_10154_10056_10055_10054_10539_10538_10537_10059_10536_10535_10534_10533_100031_10099_10338_10103_10102_5590020_10052_10053_10107_10050_10142_10051_10324_10325_10084_10083_5370020_10080_10082_10081_5610020_10110_10111_10112_10113_10114_10179_10312_10313_10314_10184_10078_10079_10073,searchweb201603_25,ppcSwitch_5&btsid=5d8d170b-e61a-4206-a053-0c559ba31878&algo_expid=d9445e9a-060e-4844-8ba2-6c6651bc977a-1&algo_pvid=d9445e9a-060e-4844-8ba2-6c6651bc977a

A bit like the TRP HY-RD or Juin calipers. i'll fit them soon and let you know.
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