Tri Talk HomepageTri Talk EventsTri Talk ForumsBlogsTri Talk TrainingTri TradeTriPlayerWikiTeam Tri Talk
Taking one for the team
Goto page Previous  1, 2
 
Post new topic   Reply to topic    TriTalk.co.uk Forum Index -> General
View previous topic :: View next topic  
Author Message
hammerer




Joined: 19 Nov 2007
Posts: 16313
Location: Right Next Door To Hell

PostPosted: Tue Oct 24, 2017 4:51 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

explorerJC wrote:
Whisk wrote:
explorerJC wrote:
hammerer wrote:
Buzz_ wrote:
hammerer wrote:
You can have all the world leading systems you like, but if one person doesnt upload their data, for whatever reason, then its falls apart.

A world leading system should be robust against a single point of failure, especially a human failure. If you can't protect against incompetence, you also can't protect against deliberate cheating.



A system is only as good as the humans operating it.


Indeed. So where were the checks?


Surely a cheque would leave too much of a paper trail - it would be cash in brown envelopes Wink

Seriously, Sky/BC might have the best technology and sporting expertise at their fingertips, but it's still a relatively small enterprise and it's run to a large extent by people who aren't necessarily from a commercial background. It wouldn't surprise me that much if their data management processes look loose when compared to the organisations that most of us work for.

Funnily enough, there was an article in Cycling Weekly about the changes to coaching staff at BC and "an insider" was complaining that the new performance director was running the high performance programme "more like an office than a cycling team" Rolling Eyes Wink


Ah! the cheques and bank balances of running a cycling team.

No coach at that level doesn't use a well honed method of recording data...unless, of course, they don't want it found...


Even I record everything with my junior squad straight to my Google Drive and then the clubs Dropbox but I do forget the latter occasionally but gets there in the end.
_________________
Blog
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
PhilleusPhogg




Joined: 11 May 2015
Posts: 238

PostPosted: Tue Oct 24, 2017 4:57 pm    Post subject: Re: Taking one for the team Reply with quote

explorerJC wrote:
PhilleusPhogg wrote:
explorerJC wrote:
http://road.cc/content/news/230988-jiffy-bag-doctor-resigns-british-cycling-due-ill-health


Interesting.

If there is worse stuff going on behind the scenes, sooner or later one of these folks who've taken one for the team will presumably do a Tyler Hamilton and realize there's a lot of books to be sold off the back of it.

On the other hand, if nothing ever comes out in the future, then surely that kind of speaks for itself right?


Yes on the first point, no on the second...or not necessarily...the UK's ineptness at dealing with these things may stop that from happening...


You might be right, just seen they looked into criminalising doping but decided it wouldn't be effective:

http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/41734299

Which is strange, since in most of the books I've read about dopers, it's when they finally get sat in a room with the feds/police that omerta/reputational damage becomes secondary to the thought of going to jail. Seems to be a very effective way of getting people to spill the beans to me, and thus an effective deterrent to future would-be doping rings?

Whether you take the party line that doing so would not help, since the UK has effective controls already, it's really a resourcing thing, or a more sinister fear that opening this up to law enforcement might make it harder to control depends on your skepticism levels Smile
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
hammerer




Joined: 19 Nov 2007
Posts: 16313
Location: Right Next Door To Hell

PostPosted: Tue Oct 24, 2017 5:30 pm    Post subject: Re: Taking one for the team Reply with quote

PhilleusPhogg wrote:
explorerJC wrote:
PhilleusPhogg wrote:
explorerJC wrote:
http://road.cc/content/news/230988-jiffy-bag-doctor-resigns-british-cycling-due-ill-health


Interesting.

If there is worse stuff going on behind the scenes, sooner or later one of these folks who've taken one for the team will presumably do a Tyler Hamilton and realize there's a lot of books to be sold off the back of it.

On the other hand, if nothing ever comes out in the future, then surely that kind of speaks for itself right?


Yes on the first point, no on the second...or not necessarily...the UK's ineptness at dealing with these things may stop that from happening...


You might be right, just seen they looked into criminalising doping but decided it wouldn't be effective:

http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/41734299

Which is strange, since in most of the books I've read about dopers, it's when they finally get sat in a room with the feds/police that omerta/reputational damage becomes secondary to the thought of going to jail. Seems to be a very effective way of getting people to spill the beans to me, and thus an effective deterrent to future would-be doping rings?

Whether you take the party line that doing so would not help, since the UK has effective controls already, it's really a resourcing thing, or a more sinister fear that opening this up to law enforcement might make it harder to control depends on your skepticism levels Smile


Maybe there's a reason France haven't been particularly successful on the road in the last 20odd years.
_________________
Blog
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
explorerJC




Joined: 20 Oct 2005
Posts: 14664
Location: Farthingstone

PostPosted: Tue Oct 24, 2017 5:34 pm    Post subject: Re: Taking one for the team Reply with quote

PhilleusPhogg wrote:
explorerJC wrote:
PhilleusPhogg wrote:
explorerJC wrote:
http://road.cc/content/news/230988-jiffy-bag-doctor-resigns-british-cycling-due-ill-health


Interesting.

If there is worse stuff going on behind the scenes, sooner or later one of these folks who've taken one for the team will presumably do a Tyler Hamilton and realize there's a lot of books to be sold off the back of it.

On the other hand, if nothing ever comes out in the future, then surely that kind of speaks for itself right?


Yes on the first point, no on the second...or not necessarily...the UK's ineptness at dealing with these things may stop that from happening...


You might be right, just seen they looked into criminalising doping but decided it wouldn't be effective:

http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/41734299

Which is strange, since in most of the books I've read about dopers, it's when they finally get sat in a room with the feds/police that omerta/reputational damage becomes secondary to the thought of going to jail. Seems to be a very effective way of getting people to spill the beans to me, and thus an effective deterrent to future would-be doping rings?

Whether you take the party line that doing so would not help, since the UK has effective controls already, it's really a resourcing thing, or a more sinister fear that opening this up to law enforcement might make it harder to control depends on your skepticism levels Smile


absolutely...

alternatively...race dope, get caught, get banned, return as a commentator...doesn't really act as a deterrent...
_________________
www.appliedtri.co.uk Tri and Du coaching

www.naturalrunningform.co.uk Natural Running Form Coach

2017 Training Camps http://www.appliedtri.co.uk/training-camps/
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Visit poster's website
Jorgan




Joined: 12 Nov 2007
Posts: 16323
Location: alles was ich bin, alles was ich war

PostPosted: Thu Oct 26, 2017 8:26 am    Post subject: Re: Taking one for the team Reply with quote

explorerJC wrote:

alternatively...race dope, get caught, get banned, return as a commentator...doesn't really act as a deterrent...


Don't forget the very stylish line of cycling apparel for like minded dandies. I'm saving-up for the Conceit bundle, which includes a free cap.
_________________
25 Years since it all began....
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
explorerJC




Joined: 20 Oct 2005
Posts: 14664
Location: Farthingstone

PostPosted: Thu Oct 26, 2017 11:17 am    Post subject: Re: Taking one for the team Reply with quote

Jorgan wrote:
explorerJC wrote:

alternatively...race dope, get caught, get banned, return as a commentator...doesn't really act as a deterrent...


Don't forget the very stylish line of cycling apparel for like minded dandies. I'm saving-up for the Conceit bundle, which includes a free cap.


Ah, but the Deceit bundle comes with a free empty coke can
_________________
www.appliedtri.co.uk Tri and Du coaching

www.naturalrunningform.co.uk Natural Running Form Coach

2017 Training Camps http://www.appliedtri.co.uk/training-camps/
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Visit poster's website
Jorgan




Joined: 12 Nov 2007
Posts: 16323
Location: alles was ich bin, alles was ich war

PostPosted: Thu Oct 26, 2017 1:00 pm    Post subject: Re: Taking one for the team Reply with quote

explorerJC wrote:
Jorgan wrote:
explorerJC wrote:

alternatively...race dope, get caught, get banned, return as a commentator...doesn't really act as a deterrent...


Don't forget the very stylish line of cycling apparel for like minded dandies. I'm saving-up for the Conceit bundle, which includes a free cap.


Ah, but the Deceit bundle comes with a free empty coke can


The best bundle is Repent, comes with a complimentary reed diffuser.
_________________
25 Years since it all began....
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
explorerJC




Joined: 20 Oct 2005
Posts: 14664
Location: Farthingstone

PostPosted: Thu Oct 26, 2017 5:52 pm    Post subject: Re: Taking one for the team Reply with quote

Jorgan wrote:
explorerJC wrote:
Jorgan wrote:
explorerJC wrote:

alternatively...race dope, get caught, get banned, return as a commentator...doesn't really act as a deterrent...


Don't forget the very stylish line of cycling apparel for like minded dandies. I'm saving-up for the Conceit bundle, which includes a free cap.


Ah, but the Deceit bundle comes with a free empty coke can


The best bundle is Repent, comes with a complimentary reed diffuser.


I thought Repent came with a seat at the WHO top table...
_________________
www.appliedtri.co.uk Tri and Du coaching

www.naturalrunningform.co.uk Natural Running Form Coach

2017 Training Camps http://www.appliedtri.co.uk/training-camps/
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Visit poster's website
Display posts from previous:   
Post new topic   Reply to topic    TriTalk.co.uk Forum Index -> General All times are GMT
Goto page Previous  1, 2
Page 2 of 2
  Share
 
Jump to:  
You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot vote in polls in this forum





Home | About TT | Privacy Policy | Terms and Conditions | Advertising | Contact TT
Copyright ©2003-2015 TriTalk®.co.uk. All rights reserved.