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Roscoemck




Joined: 10 Aug 2016
Posts: 300
Location: Glasgow

PostPosted: Fri Nov 17, 2017 8:52 am    Post subject: Turbo Trainer Reply with quote

Hey guys,

I have a very basic turbo trainer set up in my drafty, damp old shed.

At the moment the only stats I get are HR and time from my Garmin 920.

Is the Garmin Speed/Cadence sensor a worthwhile purchase? Is it accurate/reliable?

Any training plans I see for the turbo are for certain cadence and I don't really want to continue trying to count it!
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iwaters




Joined: 06 Sep 2016
Posts: 278

PostPosted: Fri Nov 17, 2017 9:32 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Speed sensor is largely useless on a turbo as it has no real bearing. Cadence can be useful but its one of those things that once you start training targeting cadence you get used to the feel.

I used to have a cadence readout when doing turbo stuff. I have a hub based power meter which gives a cadence reading. Now I know what 60 rpm feels like, 90 etc I don't bother with it. I sometimes do a quick count for 20 seconds just to make sure.

The Garmin sensor will be accurate for cadence - more so than my hub which is estimating.
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SGreg




Joined: 30 Jun 2010
Posts: 863
Location: High Peak

PostPosted: Fri Nov 17, 2017 9:51 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

On it's own it's pretty useless


But using it for Virtual power on trainerroad / Sufferfest etc... will probably be the best money you could possibly spend!
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stenard




Joined: 04 Sep 2013
Posts: 1325

PostPosted: Fri Nov 17, 2017 9:51 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

iwaters wrote:
Speed sensor is largely useless on a turbo as it has no real bearing.

Depends what you're using it for. If you want to know how fast you're going, then yes, not that useful. If you want to use the power curve of your trainer to estimate virtual power numbers, then it's vital.

I used the latter for over a year which then justified, in my mind, getting an actual power meter.
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JaRok2300




Joined: 01 May 2014
Posts: 219
Location: Worcester, UK

PostPosted: Fri Nov 17, 2017 10:04 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I don't think a speed sensor is useless on it's own.

If you're using a dumb trainer with progressive resistance then it's fine for comparison purposes from one session to the next and can be used as a simple alternative to power.

20mins at 20mph compared to 20mins at 21mph for the same heart rate a month later shows improvement. Albeit the speed itself is irrelevant compared to the real world but as long as the trainer is consistent I still think it's a useful metric.

Before I had any power measurement I would use it intervals of say 5mins at 20mph, 1min at 15mph etc.

The next step would be virtual power as already mentioned but I wouldn't rule out its value completely without that.
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explorerJC




Joined: 20 Oct 2005
Posts: 14808
Location: Farthingstone

PostPosted: Fri Nov 17, 2017 10:32 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

JaRok2300 wrote:
I don't think a speed sensor is useless on it's own.

If you're using a dumb trainer with progressive resistance then it's fine for comparison purposes from one session to the next and can be used as a simple alternative to power.

t.


that, as long as you don't expect a like for like performance outside.i may have an old garmin cadence sensor...

will take a look...
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Roscoemck




Joined: 10 Aug 2016
Posts: 300
Location: Glasgow

PostPosted: Fri Nov 17, 2017 11:10 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Thanks for all the replies guys.

I get the impression that it will help my training. The reason I'm using a dumb trainer is that there's no way I'd spend a fortune on a smart trainer then leave it in a damp shed. Taking it in and out of the house when not in use is a non starter.

***JC, thanks buddy
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hammerer




Joined: 19 Nov 2007
Posts: 16333
Location: Right Next Door To Hell

PostPosted: Fri Nov 17, 2017 11:13 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Graham Obree used to test with a dumb trainer and a speed sensor. He took out the variables and knew if his average speed was higher, he was fitter.
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jibberjim




Joined: 15 Aug 2008
Posts: 8094
Location: Kingston

PostPosted: Fri Nov 17, 2017 11:17 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

hammerer wrote:
Graham Obree used to test with a dumb trainer and a speed sensor. He took out the variables and knew if his average speed was higher, he was fitter.


Or the room was warmer...

(but yes, speed can be a proxy)
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JamieMcP




Joined: 01 Feb 2006
Posts: 4771
Location: Edinburgh

PostPosted: Fri Nov 17, 2017 2:04 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

jibberjim wrote:
hammerer wrote:
Graham Obree used to test with a dumb trainer and a speed sensor. He took out the variables and knew if his average speed was higher, he was fitter.


Or the room was warmer...

(but yes, speed can be a proxy)


His training book The Obree way has a huge chapter on just setting up your turbo and making it consistent. Its a great read, shows you how obsessive he is .
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explorerJC




Joined: 20 Oct 2005
Posts: 14808
Location: Farthingstone

PostPosted: Fri Nov 17, 2017 2:39 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

JamieMcP wrote:
jibberjim wrote:
hammerer wrote:
Graham Obree used to test with a dumb trainer and a speed sensor. He took out the variables and knew if his average speed was higher, he was fitter.


Or the room was warmer...

(but yes, speed can be a proxy)


His training book The Obree way has a huge chapter on just setting up your turbo and making it consistent. Its a great read, shows you how obsessive he is .


Mrs eJC and i spent an hour listening to him rambling on...during which time he could have cycled 52km Smile
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Roscoemck




Joined: 10 Aug 2016
Posts: 300
Location: Glasgow

PostPosted: Fri Nov 17, 2017 4:05 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

explorerJC wrote:
JamieMcP wrote:
jibberjim wrote:
hammerer wrote:
Graham Obree used to test with a dumb trainer and a speed sensor. He took out the variables and knew if his average speed was higher, he was fitter.


Or the room was warmer...

(but yes, speed can be a proxy)


His training book The Obree way has a huge chapter on just setting up your turbo and making it consistent. Its a great read, shows you how obsessive he is .


Mrs eJC and i spent an hour listening to him rambling on...during which time he could have cycled 52km Smile


He's an absolutely fascinating guy. Could listen to him for ages.
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Wells




Joined: 14 Mar 2011
Posts: 86
Location: Hampshire

PostPosted: Fri Nov 17, 2017 11:22 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

stenard wrote:
iwaters wrote:
Speed sensor is largely useless on a turbo as it has no real bearing.

Depends what you're using it for. If you want to know how fast you're going, then yes, not that useful. If you want to use the power curve of your trainer to estimate virtual power numbers, then it's vital.

I used the latter for over a year which then justified, in my mind, getting an actual power meter.


This was definitely the 'gateway drug' for my entry into the power market also
Rolling Eyes
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Roscoemck




Joined: 10 Aug 2016
Posts: 300
Location: Glasgow

PostPosted: Sat Nov 18, 2017 4:15 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Wells wrote:
stenard wrote:
iwaters wrote:
Speed sensor is largely useless on a turbo as it has no real bearing.

Depends what you're using it for. If you want to know how fast you're going, then yes, not that useful. If you want to use the power curve of your trainer to estimate virtual power numbers, then it's vital.

I used the latter for over a year which then justified, in my mind, getting an actual power meter.


This was definitely the 'gateway drug' for my entry into the power market also
Rolling Eyes


Mmm, power meter. I can see that happening at some point
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Mungo




Joined: 29 Sep 2016
Posts: 209
Location: Preston

PostPosted: Sat Nov 18, 2017 9:23 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I have one on my turbo, only an old wired thing.
Looking at heart rates it's fairly accurate.
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