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Polar V800? (yet another Garmin HRM fail)
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stenard




Joined: 04 Sep 2013
Posts: 1858

PostPosted: Thu Aug 02, 2018 4:11 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

GrahamO wrote:
You can still get the old indestructible type from Amazon

https://www.amazon.co.uk/Garmin-Monitor-Products-Including-Forerunner-black/dp/B000UOD5QM/ref=sr_1_5?ie=UTF8&qid=1533225321&sr=8-5&keywords=garmin+hrm+strap

No way I'd run a marathon in that (although no doubt fine for biking).
I do also like having the cadence info from the HRM-run (although don't really care about all the other running dynamics).
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Buzz_




Joined: 19 May 2007
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PostPosted: Thu Aug 02, 2018 4:18 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

stenard wrote:
I do also like having the cadence info from the HRM-run (although don't really care about all the other running dynamics).


I believe cadence comes from the watch, or at least it does on the newer devices, as I still get cadence if running with just the wrist hr. Only done this when don't have a strap to hand as the wrist hr is pretty unreliable, especially at extremes of temperature, but do remember being surprised that Garmin Connect still displayed cadence.
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stenard




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PostPosted: Thu Aug 02, 2018 4:22 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Buzz_ wrote:
stenard wrote:
I do also like having the cadence info from the HRM-run (although don't really care about all the other running dynamics).


I believe cadence comes from the watch, or at least it does on the newer devices, as I still get cadence if running with just the wrist hr. Only done this when don't have a strap to hand as the wrist hr is pretty unreliable, especially at extremes of temperature, but do remember being surprised that Garmin Connect still displayed cadence.

Yes it does as a fall back, but as you imply with HR, it's not entirely accurate. The watch can make an educated guess on a lot of things, like treadmill pace without a footpod, but it's ultimately just guessing. Grab a water bottle for example whilst running, and it will think you've stopped.
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Buzz_




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PostPosted: Thu Aug 02, 2018 4:28 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

stenard wrote:
Yes it does as a fall back, but as you imply with HR, it's not entirely accurate. The watch can make an educated guess on a lot of things, like treadmill pace without a footpod, but it's ultimately just guessing. Grab a water bottle for example whilst running, and it will think you've stopped.

Depends what you want it for I guess. I only casually overlay it with pace or elevation to see how it trends against the rest of the run. Dropping out for a few metres in that case is no big deal.
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GrahamO




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PostPosted: Thu Aug 02, 2018 4:36 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

stenard wrote:
No way I'd run a marathon in that (although no doubt fine for biking)


So despite people using it for for a decade and many for running because it was the default HRM for a very long time with running watches, its apparently too heavy for you ? Very Happy

You make it sound like its a house brick. Its not.
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stenard




Joined: 04 Sep 2013
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PostPosted: Thu Aug 02, 2018 4:49 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

GrahamO wrote:
stenard wrote:
No way I'd run a marathon in that (although no doubt fine for biking)


So despite people using it for for a decade and many for running because it was the default HRM for a very long time with running watches, its apparently too heavy for you ? Very Happy

You make it sound like its a house brick. Its not.

It's not the heaviness. I have no idea how heavy it is. No idea why you would have thought that was the case. It's the chafing.

I can't even run in the Garmin "premium soft straps" for any length of time without serious chafing. I wouldn't want to consider one that's half plastic. I changed to the polar soft straps on the recommendation of a few sites where people had encountered the same issue (maybe it was even on here than people pointed me to the DCR post on the subject), and they are fine. Hence being wedded to detachable pods that I can put on a strap of my choosing, and rotate around a number of straps that are regularly washed.

The new Garmin HR straps are nice, and much more comfortable. But for the reasons stated above, I try and limit the use of those integrated ones.
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GrahamO




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PostPosted: Thu Aug 02, 2018 5:09 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

stenard wrote:
It's not the heaviness. I have no idea how heavy it is. No idea why you would have thought that was the case. It's the chafing..


Okay, you have no idea how heavy it is, you have no idea what its like to wear one but have decided that it will chafe ? Thats not very scientific is it ? But its your choice.

FYI I wore it for countless half-marathons without a single issue. And I'm a tad stout so rubbing was an issue. It lies flat across the chest just below the pecs, the plastic is actually quite flexible and the back strap is the exact same material the other Garmin devices use. The inflexible bit is the central 4" where the sensors are, and that bit fits across the flat bit of your chest so being solid isnt an issue. I actually had one of those tiny pod types but found those kept packing up so went back to my old 205 strap which has served me well. After more than a few years of use, its also no longer straight, but is permanently curved to my shape.

Get a cheap on - give it a go and I think you'll find the chafing is nonexistent.
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stenard




Joined: 04 Sep 2013
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PostPosted: Thu Aug 02, 2018 9:51 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Maybe I just have sensitive skin?!
The plastic bits of the Garmin soft strap cause me issues. The fully fabric polar soft straps are better. Hence the presumption adding a lot more plastic to the mix would be a disaster.

Ultimately, I think it comes down to how I sweat. I'm super salty and that causes me issues. After my long run Sunday, the front of my hips and the base of my back were raw from where my shorts had made contact with my skin (I hadn't pulled my compression shorts up fully after a toilet stop). I bekieve it's that which causes my aggravation with some HR straps.

That said, I take your general point. I shouldn't be so dismissive until I've actually tried something and ruled it out.
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fenn123




Joined: 25 Aug 2011
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PostPosted: Thu Aug 02, 2018 10:32 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Jorgan wrote:
stenard wrote:
Out of interest, what failed with the HRM tri?


Just stopped working overnight, much like the HRM-Run before it. Makes me wonder if they're not as waterproof as intended, as it seems to happen overnight after I've rinsed them. Done all the troubleshooting advice (new battery, shorting the contacts etc) - won't connect with anything.

80-odd is a lot for something so 'consumable'.


I have had the Tri and now the Run version just stop on me recently. Garmin replaced the Tri but it failed 6 months later (then I bought the run version to try).

I like having heart rate so just picked up premium version for 30 from halfords to tied me over.

Have you tried the fix they are suggesting by 'shorting' it? This worked for me after a battery change. I sweat a lot and have put that down to the reason they don't last much more then 6-8 months.

I am tempted to try the 935 with wrist hr.
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Jorgan




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PostPosted: Fri Aug 03, 2018 7:27 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

fenn123 wrote:
Have you tried the fix they are suggesting by 'shorting' it? This worked for me after a battery change. I sweat a lot and have put that down to the reason they don't last much more then 6-8 months.


Yeah done all that; even tried it with the older HRM-RUN that was still in the cupboard! 6-8 months is crap for what they cost though isn't it! (TRI was over 80).

I have a Wahoo TICKR on order, and the HRM-TRI is on its way back to Wiggle for refund/replacement.

Who remembers the old Polar sealed units from the early 90s? Think you could send it back and get a discount on a new one - like a recyclable. I could never afford one as a student though, but we did have a loan-pool of Polar Sport Testers; so I got to borrow a 250 HRM 25 years ago!
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Jorgan




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PostPosted: Fri Aug 03, 2018 7:29 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

stenard wrote:

But that's my point. I actively have never bought a newer HRM-run as you can still buy the older version with the detachable pod.


That was the first pod I used with the 920, with a Polar strap. The pod failed after about 7 months; next was the RUN. Failed. Then the TRI. Failed. This is all inside 2 years.

My old Polar RCX5 is still in the cupboard; I bet if I go & fire-up the Hybrid chest pod, it'll probably still work.
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stenard




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PostPosted: Fri Aug 03, 2018 8:44 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Jorgan wrote:
stenard wrote:

But that's my point. I actively have never bought a newer HRM-run as you can still buy the older version with the detachable pod.


That was the first pod I used with the 920, with a Polar strap. The pod failed after about 7 months; next was the RUN. Failed. Then the TRI. Failed. This is all inside 2 years.

My old Polar RCX5 is still in the cupboard; I bet if I go & fire-up the Hybrid chest pod, it'll probably still work.

Blimey! That is rather weird. Never had a pod fail, and as I indicate above, I sweat buckets, with high concentration! I can understand why you are getting a bit fed up in that case.
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fenn123




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PostPosted: Fri Aug 03, 2018 1:47 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Jorgan wrote:
stenard wrote:

But that's my point. I actively have never bought a newer HRM-run as you can still buy the older version with the detachable pod.


That was the first pod I used with the 920, with a Polar strap. The pod failed after about 7 months; next was the RUN. Failed. Then the TRI. Failed. This is all inside 2 years.

My old Polar RCX5 is still in the cupboard; I bet if I go & fire-up the Hybrid chest pod, it'll probably still work.


FWIW I just called Garmin and complained. They have previously replaced the Tri. They apologised and are going to replace the Run and TRI belt. Given me the return details etc.

Will see, but customer support today was good.
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Andy916




Joined: 08 Oct 2011
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PostPosted: Fri Aug 03, 2018 2:38 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

My old-style HRM-run failed once in 4 years, suspected water ingress, and I found a new one for 40 quid (they do appear to be scarce now though).

The run metrics are important to me, possibly more so than HR. GCT in particular, there's a clear and consistent variation with run form, pace, tiredness, sector of the race or session, and up/downhill.

Had a Polar S610i for a decade before switching to Garmin 920XT. Having 15 years of data including HR is valuable, although the Win7 machine that hosts the Polar software won't last forever. Had the old hard strap originally, and switched to soft strap asap (it slips down to a greater extent than the soft strap, if you're quite triangular).

The old Polar gave me HR for the swim, but it would fail half the time, especially when non-wetsuit. I suspect it was losing pickup due to being dislodged by body rotation, so I wonder if the current Garmin straps suffers the same fate?

I guess my next monitor in a couple of years will have optical instead of chest strap...
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stenard




Joined: 04 Sep 2013
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PostPosted: Fri Aug 03, 2018 2:50 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Andy916 wrote:

The old Polar gave me HR for the swim, but it would fail half the time, especially when non-wetsuit. I suspect it was losing pickup due to being dislodged by body rotation, so I wonder if the current Garmin straps suffers the same fate?

I guess my next monitor in a couple of years will have optical instead of chest strap...

On the former, no. The newer Garmin and Suunto HR straps that do swimming HR cache the HR data and then transmit it afterwards. So it doesn't rely on a consistent connection in the water (ant+ and BT can't transmit more than a few cm underwater anyway).

As for optical, I think that depends on who you are, your skin type, hairiness, etc. All my testing with wrist based optical, including ones that are considered really good, have been inaccurate for me. DCR says that's just the case for some people.
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