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Bottle placement aero data
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Chrace




Joined: 28 Apr 2010
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PostPosted: Tue Sep 18, 2018 8:32 am    Post subject: Bottle placement aero data Reply with quote

Just saw this one pop up:
https://www.aero-coach.co.uk/aero-testing-services/aero-testing-data

There goes my convenience approach to IM.

Oh wait, I don't have aid stations and am not on a TT bike. Phew!
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ed_m




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PostPosted: Tue Sep 18, 2018 9:27 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Nice to know that my IM bike times have only been a minute slower than they could have been.
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Gus




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PostPosted: Tue Sep 18, 2018 10:36 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Oh dear, I think I've added a whole 3 minutes on to my 8.45hr IM bike ride.

Oh well, bang went my podium place.
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Doonhamer




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PostPosted: Tue Sep 18, 2018 12:26 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Velominati adherents will be seething.
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Jorgan




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PostPosted: Tue Sep 18, 2018 2:57 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

For the last 2 seasons I've actually gone back to a bar mounted bottle/straw (Torhans 30) rather than a 'BTA' round bottle. Additionally I've have a cage behind the saddle. So 0.3w (x2) at 30kph.

I think the less integrated your front-end is, the better something like the Torhans/Profile etc. as it smooths the airflow.
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bradjenkins




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PostPosted: Thu Sep 20, 2018 8:33 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Haha. Nice one.

Gus wrote:
Oh dear, I think I've added a whole 3 minutes on to my 8.45hr IM bike ride.

Oh well, bang went my podium place.
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ed_m




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PostPosted: Thu Sep 20, 2018 9:22 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Jorgan wrote:
For the last 2 seasons I've actually gone back to a bar mounted bottle/straw (Torhans 30) rather than a 'BTA' round bottle. Additionally I've have a cage behind the saddle. So 0.3w (x2) at 30kph.

I think the less integrated your front-end is, the better something like the Torhans/Profile etc. as it smooths the airflow.


cos you need a few seconds off your ironman time .... ?
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Jorgan




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PostPosted: Thu Sep 20, 2018 9:42 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

ed_m wrote:
Jorgan wrote:
For the last 2 seasons I've actually gone back to a bar mounted bottle/straw (Torhans 30) rather than a 'BTA' round bottle. Additionally I've have a cage behind the saddle. So 0.3w (x2) at 30kph.

I think the less integrated your front-end is, the better something like the Torhans/Profile etc. as it smooths the airflow.


cos you need a few seconds off your ironman time .... ?


Sadly, this was the set-up I used back then, so I'll just have to train harder Rolling Eyes
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explorerJC




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PostPosted: Thu Sep 20, 2018 9:51 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

The data missing, of course, is how long you are out of aero drinking, and the energy/time cost of replen...

but that is quite a test to manage...
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hammerer
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PostPosted: Thu Sep 20, 2018 10:37 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

explorerJC wrote:
The data missing, of course, is how long you are out of aero drinking, and the energy/time cost of replen...

but that is quite a test to manage...


reaching behind to rear mount is quite the pain in the arse.
Must cost more time than you save over a BTA bottle.
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explorerJC




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PostPosted: Thu Sep 20, 2018 11:01 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

hammerer wrote:
explorerJC wrote:
The data missing, of course, is how long you are out of aero drinking, and the energy/time cost of replen...

but that is quite a test to manage...


reaching behind to rear mount is quite the pain in the arse.
Must cost more time than you save over a BTA bottle.


yep, my thoughts too...
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Jorgan




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PostPosted: Thu Sep 20, 2018 11:11 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

explorerJC wrote:
hammerer wrote:

reaching behind to rear mount is quite the pain in the arse.
Must cost more time than you save over a BTA bottle.


yep, my thoughts too...


I don't think anyone uses a saddle mounted bottle as their main means of hydration though, more as storage for an extra bottle for the start of the event, or to stash a hand-up.
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explorerJC




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PostPosted: Thu Sep 20, 2018 11:49 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Jorgan wrote:
explorerJC wrote:
hammerer wrote:

reaching behind to rear mount is quite the pain in the arse.
Must cost more time than you save over a BTA bottle.


yep, my thoughts too...


I don't think anyone uses a saddle mounted bottle as their main means of hydration though, more as storage for an extra bottle for the start of the event, or to stash a hand-up.


i think a test needs to include the cost of replen to really add value to this debate...
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stenard




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PostPosted: Thu Sep 20, 2018 12:52 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

explorerJC wrote:
Jorgan wrote:
explorerJC wrote:
hammerer wrote:

reaching behind to rear mount is quite the pain in the arse.
Must cost more time than you save over a BTA bottle.


yep, my thoughts too...


I don't think anyone uses a saddle mounted bottle as their main means of hydration though, more as storage for an extra bottle for the start of the event, or to stash a hand-up.


i think a test needs to include the cost of replen to really add value to this debate...

But if you are going to go down that route, then you also need to determine the aero cost of actually drinking from a round BTA bottle. Same as Jorgan, I use a Torhans Aero 30. I guess there must be an aero penalty associated with the protruding straw, yet I can drink with effectively no impact on my position. I also have a BTS bottle, but that only gets touched once to refill the Torhans.

With a round BTA bottle, every single sip will require breaking aero to get the bottle out and drink from it. That's got to cost way more than the penalty of a protruding straw and a more vertical BTA hydration bottle.
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Buzz_




Joined: 19 May 2007
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PostPosted: Thu Sep 20, 2018 1:56 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Nothing can be taken in isolation. The best solution may depend on the course or the rider. Yes you can't drink from a BTA or downtube bottle without breaking aero, but that might happen anyway if the course dictates or the rider needs a break.

I tend to drink on uphills, stops me going too much into the red. Or I sit up and drink if stuck behind traffic on an open course, or a bunch of drafters. Helps to diffuse the annoyance from being held up.
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