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Ultra Pack - what size ? for a 50m run

 
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Must Tri More




Joined: 21 Sep 2009
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Location: KINGSTON

PostPosted: Sat Dec 01, 2018 9:08 pm    Post subject: Ultra Pack - what size ? for a 50m run Reply with quote

Doing Race to the King next year and wonder what size vest/pack people use for a 53 mile run ?

Was looking at the Ultimate Direction range which has 8L, 10L and 12L.

Thanks in advance
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gingerbongo




Joined: 21 Sep 2012
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PostPosted: Mon Dec 03, 2018 9:41 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I've done 100km and 100 miles with an Osprey Duro 6l.

Fine for the 100km, but i could've done with a tad more space for the 100 miler (so when i did the next one i borrowed a friend's 15l one, which incidentally i think was a tad too big! haha)
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doug




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PostPosted: Mon Dec 03, 2018 10:14 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Difficult to say - depends on what you want to stuff into it !

Which might depend on what the mandatory kit list is like, the weather and the terrain.

I have an 8litre North Face pack that I use for most races up to and including 60miles. I also have a 20litre Salomon pack I use when I need to carry more (like for the last 30miles of the WHW Challenge where a sleeping bag was mandatory).

If the pack has good compression straps to stop things rattling around when not full, then I would go for a larger size than you think you need, the difference in weight is probably insignificant, but it gives a bit more flexibility if the weather looks foul and you decide to carry some spare kit.
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r0bh




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PostPosted: Mon Dec 03, 2018 11:23 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

What is the mandatory kit list for your event? What time of year is it?
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gingerbongo




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PostPosted: Mon Dec 03, 2018 12:47 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

RTTK is pretty beginner friendly as i understand it. Summer race and not ridiculous mandatory kit list.

But comfort is they key as opposed to pure size. I absolutely love my Osprey one and it fits like a dream. Also consider the hydration options.
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smitters




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PostPosted: Thu Dec 06, 2018 5:26 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I use a Salomon S-Lab Sense Ultra 5 set for 50s. I found it perfect (even too big) for a summer ultra with well stocked aid stations Like RTTS.

I was able to pack one litre of water, first aid, food, headtorch, waterproof jacket and trousers, warm top, hat, gloves, buff, phone and headphones, map, compass, spare batteries, loo roll, survival blanket, vaseline, 6x gels and 5x tailwind into it for a winter ultra where the only aid in 46 miles was water stations every 12km or so. If pushed, I probably could have squeezed another 1.5l of water in the back in a bladder, and if I'd used the belt mentioned below, loads more.

I have recently added a running belt from Naked so I can stow poles and have a bit more storage, or a very lean solution for a shorter race/training.

Unless you are madated to carry lots of bulky kit, anything over 8 litres is begging you to over pack in a summer ultra.

Fair points made above though on getting more into a bigger pack easily if you have to. For what it's worth, my cold weather gear for the winter ultra was a short sleeve base layer, long sleeve merino top, OMM synthetic insulated jacket (in the pack) plus waterproof. It's lean kit-wise, and in an emergency that stopped me moving, I've have to get all my gear on and the survival blanket on sharpish, but on a supported event, you expect some back-up. I debated shorts/longs depending on the weather of the day. If I'd been going solo (i.e. no event, just out on the hills), I'd have worn longs for certain. I'd have been happy as long as I was moving down to about -5, but much colder and I'd have had issues, mainly with feet and hands. Its horses for courses though - train with what you have, refine, test, refine, test and you'll know what works.
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FatPom




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PostPosted: Thu Dec 06, 2018 6:09 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

gingerbongo wrote:
RTTK is pretty beginner friendly as i understand it. Summer race and not ridiculous mandatory kit list.

But comfort is they key as opposed to pure size. I absolutely love my Osprey one and it fits like a dream. Also consider the hydration options.


Just looked this up for RttS and as far as I can tell, there is no mandatory kit at all, just 'recommended'
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Chrace




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PostPosted: Mon Dec 10, 2018 9:52 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

We got loads of ultra runners on here so they'll know better. But - it's the internet so I'll do an ill-informed reply anyway. Wink

Until now I've been using an Inov8 Race Pac 4 which is just about enough for mandatory kit and a few extras on a normal marathon (used for Triathlon X). I added 2x Raidlight bottle holders to the front which balances it out quite well with mandatory kit plus FA and food. If I was ever to do a summer ultra that's what I would bring to force myself to stay light and not overpack.

It's not enough for winter though so recently got a Raidlight Olmo 12L (cheapest I found was here - 60 posted, no bottles). Used it recently on a night run and found it, well, amazing. I had it packed pretty heavy (winter night run in the Lakes) - but I forgot I was wearing it. Really well balanced. It also has front holders for poles. Only downside is the side pockets can be hard to access on the go with gloves.

I'm only answering since I saw "Raidlight" and "12L" mentioned as a couple of keywords and giving feedback of specific kit. I think smitters is the man to listen to here though.

(Imho biggest consideration is amount of liquid you need since this seem to vary massively between people.)
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smitters




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PostPosted: Tue Dec 11, 2018 1:00 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Chrace wrote:
I think smitters is the man to listen to here though.


Dear God no. Never. Ever.


That said, I went back and looked - all that kit went into a 3 litre Salomon vest, not 5 litre. Unless you need a flexibly large bag for other things, running vests/bags are the sort of thing I think do well being just right. Overpacking a small bag if a pain, and having too big a bag often gives a bouncy object on your back, whether it's loosely flapping and half empty or overfilled due to the "I may need that" syndrome, which I suffer from heavily.

I have a colleague who proudly showed me his new long run bag - 12 litres - and I cannot possibly imagine what one might need in the four hours they'll be out on the local roads around home so large as to require a 12 litre bag. I was polite though.
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FatPom




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PostPosted: Tue Dec 11, 2018 1:14 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Dipped my toe into the world of ultra kit and got myself one of these.

http://www.wiggle.co.uk/salomon-pulse-belt/
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gingerbongo




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PostPosted: Tue Dec 11, 2018 3:29 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Now you've got to go out running for hours to test it!!
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FatPom




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PostPosted: Tue Dec 11, 2018 4:31 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

gingerbongo wrote:
Now you've got to go out running for hours to test it!!


damn Very Happy
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explorerJC




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PostPosted: Tue Dec 11, 2018 10:32 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Doug is correct on the mandatory, Smitters too with how much you can carry in a relatively small pack...

Two points to consider, if you are training for longer or for races with greater mandatory then get what you need now and get used to it...also, reflect on when you may need access to things and whether you can get them without emptying everything out...
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smitters




Joined: 27 Aug 2009
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PostPosted: Wed Dec 12, 2018 12:58 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

explorerJC wrote:
Doug is correct on the mandatory, Smitters too with how much you can carry in a relatively small pack...

Two points to consider, if you are training for longer or for races with greater mandatory then get what you need now and get used to it...also, reflect on when you may need access to things and whether you can get them without emptying everything out...


Couldn't agree more on both points. Doesn't need to be shiny shiny kit either (sacrilege), but it does need to do the job. I always cite waterproof trousers as an example - as a runner, I don't intend to wear them when moving, so breathability is a non-issue. I haven't found anything that breathes adequately when I run up hill, including a vest and shorts. If I do have to put them on, the #@?# is hitting the fan, so totally waterproof means I can sit down in them, or they'll keep everything out. As such, 10 Trekmates ones do me fine. Much lighter than the pricey breathable ones too.

As for accessing stuff, again, stopping means getting cold, losing time and in my (short-tempered) case, irritating the ~#*$ out of me if it's a training partner and we're on a proper run, not a jaunt or jolly. In a race you don't stop to get a sandwich from the bottom of the bag then sit down and eat it sedately. You put the sandwich/gel/pepperami somewhere you can grab it and don't stop moving your feet, so it's worth practicing this in training.

I'm also living proof you can remove an S-Lab vest, remove a club running vest, remove the t-shirt under that, replace the club vest, replace the S-Lab vest, stow the t-shirt and chastise yourself for being an overdressed dick, all while doing sub 8 minute miles, much to the amusement of all the other half marathon runners around you (it was a kit test race).

ETA - I got this and it's very good: https://www.centurionultrarunningstore.com/products/naked-running-band Not had much mileage with poles stashed as I've only just got my collapsing ones (cheap, from Alpkit) and I've got a dicky calf. Note to self, buying one at your summer race weight is depressing...
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FatPom




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PostPosted: Wed Dec 12, 2018 1:17 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Wild Ginger Running has just done two YT clips on Wproof jackets and trousers. I quite like her channel.
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