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fat buddha




Joined: 13 Jul 2004
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Location: rural Zuzzex

PostPosted: Tue Dec 05, 2017 5:15 pm    Post subject: Atrial fibrillation Reply with quote

well, it turns out I have AF which will explain why my running and biking has been pants this year - I was putting this down to age and loss of mojo, but it seems there was more to this than I realised at the time. Rolling Eyes

this all culminated in me having a minor stroke on the 24th November and I'm on the mend and have nearly 100% movement back in my left arm and leg (no speech or facial problems thankfully). for the mo, I'm on anticoagulant and beta-blocker therapy, can't drive for a month, and now waiting to see a cardiologist to discuss treatment of the AF - probably cardioversion or ablation.

but I want to get back to some form of CV exercise while I wait for this (I might go privately if the wait is long) and wondered if anyone out there who's had/has AF has any tips they'd like to share or help me with.

cheers
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explorerJC




Joined: 20 Oct 2005
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PostPosted: Tue Dec 05, 2017 8:06 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Very sorry to hear that FB.

On the AF, I have friends who have suffered and recovered although one (multiple ETU/ITU champ) never got completely back to speed.

As for recovery from a stroke, I had one in 2001 (in fact, I probably had more than one) and it took a couple of years to really make progress and start to recover my fitness properly..I think I was back in the GB AG team by 2004 or 2005
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Roscoemck




Joined: 10 Aug 2016
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Location: Glasgow

PostPosted: Tue Dec 05, 2017 8:50 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

FB, sorry to hear that.

Can't offer any advice, just want to let you know I'm thinking about you. Take it easy.
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fat buddha




Joined: 13 Jul 2004
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Location: rural Zuzzex

PostPosted: Wed Dec 06, 2017 9:47 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

thanks for the comments guys.

having the stroke came as a bit of a shock but thankfully, and compared to many others, I have come out of this very lightly and am expected to have a full recovery. from what I have found, exercising with permanent AF (which is what I have, not the transient variety) is OK provided I put a lid on matters and don't try and go eyeballs out - just take it calmly.

swimming and using the turbo/rower seems to be best at the mo so I'll start with that and see how the body reacts. might hang back from running until I feel fully confident that my left leg knows what it's doing - it seems OK walking but running might challenge it a bit more, so leave that a few more weeks.

the big pisser is not being able to drive as I am now dependent on Mrs FB and what little public transport we have around here. hey ho - only a month and not a year!
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ed_m




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PostPosted: Wed Dec 06, 2017 10:11 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

fat buddha wrote:

the big pisser is not being able to drive as I am now dependent on Mrs FB and what little public transport we have around here. hey ho - only a month and not a year!


A chance to make use of your free bus pass no ?
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fat buddha




Joined: 13 Jul 2004
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Location: rural Zuzzex

PostPosted: Wed Dec 06, 2017 10:19 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

ed_m wrote:
fat buddha wrote:

the big pisser is not being able to drive as I am now dependent on Mrs FB and what little public transport we have around here. hey ho - only a month and not a year!


A chance to make use of your free bus pass no ?


already being used Ed - had a couple of "grand tours" of crap Sussex housing estates so far.... Wink
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Banana Boy




Joined: 16 Apr 2007
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PostPosted: Wed Dec 06, 2017 11:44 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

FB, I'm a very occasional poster on Tritalk but I have AF.
I had a pacemaker fitted in 1997 for irregular heart beat and have taken warfarin ever since, developed permanent AF in 2002 after a virus.

Started triathlon in 2001, have raced sprint to IM so it hasn't stopped me in that way. Much as I'd like to cite it as a reason for lack of pereformance I'm not sure it's had any major impact in that way.

The main impact based on my (non scientific) observation is that the warm up for any activity is harder. I'm nearly always breathless for the first 5-10 mins of any session (particularly running) no matter what pace. If I then stop for a minute or so I feel much better and, in general, my performance improves as the session goes on. In a race situation if I don't warm up (which I don't) then I tend to underperform on the swim.

The other issue for me is that I'm very conscious of not crashing on the bike as any bleeding takes ages to stop (and scars take ages to heal) so I'll avoid risks on downhill.

Good luck with your training!
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fat buddha




Joined: 13 Jul 2004
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Location: rural Zuzzex

PostPosted: Wed Dec 06, 2017 11:57 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

thanks for the input BB - very useful

Quote:
The other issue for me is that I'm very conscious of not crashing on the bike as any bleeding takes ages to stop (and scars take ages to heal) so I'll avoid risks on downhill.


in some ways you're luckier in that warfarin can be counteracted in the case of heavy bleeding with a shot of Vit K - I've been put on Atrixaban, one of the newer anticoags, to which there is no antidote so if I have a heavy bleed, then it could be a major problem! Sad I've bought a medical alert dogtag that sits on me all the time which will alert any paramedic. the upside of atrixaban is that I don't need blood levels monitoring which you do on warfarin.

as someone who has been a downhill nutter on a bike (road or MTB) and a dedicated off-piste skier with a few crashes under the belt, I guess I'm going to have to become a bit more risk averse! and a bit more careful with power tools...... Wink
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JeffB




Joined: 04 May 2008
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PostPosted: Wed Dec 06, 2017 8:04 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Sorry to hear about it FB, hope you recover quickly.

I know someone who has a heart issue that it starts racing from time to time and has to get the electric shock to get it back into rhythm, which I'm guessing is AF. He was a very good athlete in his younger days and although he doesn't really race much now when he trains he is still good for his age, I'd guess in his younger days he'd have been around 2:05 for an Olympic tri, maybe quicker.

Also know (of) several people that have had strokes generally in their late 40's, at least 3 are still very good runners, 18:xx 5k times for V50 cat, as it turned out at least two had undiagnosed holes in their hearts which was the cause.

A lad I work with is as fit as a lat, and other than cholesterol being slightly high even one of the top stroke surgeons in the country couldn't really work out why he'd had one. It took him a while to get over it but as I mentioned he can still run well but has never really been interested in anything longer than about 10k.

The two I know best do have to manage their fatigue and cut back or not train if they are tired.

Do they think the AF has led to the stroke or some other reason?

EJC, having seen what I'm guessing is you, you don't look like an obvious candidate for a stroke either, and would have appeared to have got back to a good level of fitness.

Jeff
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explorerJC




Joined: 20 Oct 2005
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PostPosted: Wed Dec 06, 2017 8:39 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

JeffB wrote:


Also know (of) several people that have had strokes generally in their late 40's, at least 3 are still very good runners, 18:xx 5k times for V50 cat, as it turned out at least two had undiagnosed holes in their hearts which was the cause

The two I know best do have to manage their fatigue and cut back or not train if they are tired.

EJC, having seen what I'm guessing is you, you don't look like an obvious candidate for a stroke either, and would have appeared to have got back to a good level of fitness.

Jeff

Patience is the key to recovery. Fortunately I was with a good employer (joined 6 weeks before) and they paid me whilst I recovered and funded rehab and occupational health. Mind you, they got shot of me as soon as they could after I was back full time about 2 years later!

Managing fatigue levels was hard for a long time and gaining mobility a challenge. I just dug in and focussed on being able get to the next level. It took about3 - 4 years to get back into it and 6 or so become competitive...
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fat buddha




Joined: 13 Jul 2004
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Location: rural Zuzzex

PostPosted: Thu Dec 07, 2017 9:19 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

JeffB - thanks for the input - very illuminating!

Quote:
Do they think the AF has led to the stroke or some other reason?


convinced AF is the cause - it's one of the most common causes (5x higher risk of stroke in AF patients) and I don't have other risk factors associated with stroke bar a consumption of alcohol well over recommended guidelines Rolling Eyes which itself may have been a cause of the AF, although that is by no way clear (the underlying cause of AF is actually poorly understood despite it being pretty common)
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doubletriple




Joined: 25 Feb 2009
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Location: Bristol

PostPosted: Wed Dec 13, 2017 1:30 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Hi...had AF on and off for @ 15 years....been clear for @5 now.
I had paroxysmal AF as in no obvious underlying cause. in the majority of these cases it usually comes down to lifestyle.
Drugs, stress , Alcohol etc.
Have had cardioversion....chemical and physical , and ablation. Each in turn reverted eventually back to AF episodes.
I have altered my lifestyle choices hugely , and have been AF free for some years.
In my opionion , lifestyle factors are uaually the trigger.
Good luck.
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tin pot




Joined: 08 Jul 2013
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PostPosted: Thu Dec 14, 2017 7:59 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

JeffB wrote:
Sorry to hear about it FB, hope you recover quickly.

I know someone who has a heart issue that it starts racing from time to time and has to get the electric shock to get it back into rhythm, which I'm guessing is AF. He was a very good athlete in his younger days and although he doesn't really race much now when he trains he is still good for his age, I'd guess in his younger days he'd have been around 2:05 for an Olympic tri, maybe quicker.

Also know (of) several people that have had strokes generally in their late 40's, at least 3 are still very good runners, 18:xx 5k times for V50 cat, as it turned out at least two had undiagnosed holes in their hearts which was the cause.

A lad I work with is as fit as a lat, and other than cholesterol being slightly high even one of the top stroke surgeons in the country couldn't really work out why he'd had one. It took him a while to get over it but as I mentioned he can still run well but has never really been interested in anything longer than about 10k.

The two I know best do have to manage their fatigue and cut back or not train if they are tired.

Do they think the AF has led to the stroke or some other reason?

EJC, having seen what I'm guessing is you, you don't look like an obvious candidate for a stroke either, and would have appeared to have got back to a good level of fitness.

Jeff


Iím not a huge fan of Phil Maffetone but with my recent vascular concerns I was listening to an Endurance Planet podcast yesterday where he was emphasising that heart issues are as common with athletes as with anyone else. And that itís the underlying risk you need to examine from family medical history primarily.

Iím not sure why weíve assumed athletes are healthy, I suppose itís because they usually look so good.
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fat buddha




Joined: 13 Jul 2004
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Location: rural Zuzzex

PostPosted: Thu Dec 14, 2017 8:59 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Tin Pot wrote:
JeffB wrote:
Sorry to hear about it FB, hope you recover quickly.

I know someone who has a heart issue that it starts racing from time to time and has to get the electric shock to get it back into rhythm, which I'm guessing is AF. He was a very good athlete in his younger days and although he doesn't really race much now when he trains he is still good for his age, I'd guess in his younger days he'd have been around 2:05 for an Olympic tri, maybe quicker.

Also know (of) several people that have had strokes generally in their late 40's, at least 3 are still very good runners, 18:xx 5k times for V50 cat, as it turned out at least two had undiagnosed holes in their hearts which was the cause.

A lad I work with is as fit as a lat, and other than cholesterol being slightly high even one of the top stroke surgeons in the country couldn't really work out why he'd had one. It took him a while to get over it but as I mentioned he can still run well but has never really been interested in anything longer than about 10k.

The two I know best do have to manage their fatigue and cut back or not train if they are tired.

Do they think the AF has led to the stroke or some other reason?

EJC, having seen what I'm guessing is you, you don't look like an obvious candidate for a stroke either, and would have appeared to have got back to a good level of fitness.

Jeff


Iím not a huge fan of Phil Maffetone but with my recent vascular concerns I was listening to an Endurance Planet podcast yesterday where he was emphasising that heart issues are as common with athletes as with anyone else. And that itís the underlying risk you need to examine from family medical history primarily.

Iím not sure why weíve assumed athletes are healthy, I suppose itís because they usually look so good.


from what I have found, quite a few athletic friends seem to have suffered from AF or some other type of arrythmia, yet, after treatment it doesn't seem to have reduced their interest in maintaining fitness, even if they no longer compete or go balls out.

"usually look good". ha - you're talking to an ex-prop here weighing over 100kg and with cauliflower ears..... Laughing
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Laufmann




Joined: 17 May 2010
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PostPosted: Sat Jan 05, 2019 8:08 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

FB, found your post via a search I did before posting as a fresh topic. Interested to know how you are getting on a year later, and also if anyone has any thoughts on my situation.

In 2017 after 2 iron distance races that year, I switched my emphasis back to running and really enjoyed getting speeed back with a running club after lapsing into long and slow for some time. Pretty soon I was experiencing a weird sensation about 6-10 mins into a race (mostly 10 ks), accompanied by a sudden loss of power. I was able to run through this while people overtook me, and then after about half a minute or so, returned to my previous pace. I did not think much about it, other than it was annoying and unpredictable.

In October 2018, I had a much worse episode and felt really unwell, but the loss of power was so severe, I was forced to walk for the first time ever in many years of running (outside of extreme conditions such as fell races and hills on iron distance tri). I did recover though and ended up running as normal again within about 2 minutes. But since then I have had a few more incidents, including a Parkrun on Xmas day, from which there was no recovery. 5K felt like a 1/2 M despite being 5 mins slower than my normal time, and it took me about 2 hours to recover from afterwards.

This prompted me to contact my GP who gave me a consultation via phone and gave me some food for thought. She suggested that I monitor the situation and that we review it mid Jan, with the probability that I have some tests done. Since then I have looked on the internet on the basis of what she told me, and Afib seems a possibility. From what I have found out online, Afib incidence is much higher in endurance athletes, especially from middle age onwards (I have just turned 60). But as someone outside the typical clientele of my local surgery, I thought the collective wisdom of the TT community might be helpful ahead of speaking to the GP again. These mysterious episodes which might have nothing to do with Afib, have the following characteristics:

* Come on abruptly mid run without any warning, as if a switch has suddenly been turned off.
* A degree of nausea, but no great chest discomfort.
* No marked change of HR in the earlier episodes, but elevated recently and staying high even with a greatly reduced pace (but highest rates not higher than my normal max rates).
* In all the cases where it has been so bad that I have had to stop, when I resume running again at whatever pace, there is an ache in my right shoulder, which stops when I stop running.
* This has only happened in racing or very fast paced training in running, and I have had nothing similar in swimming or cycling (though I probably have not pushed as hard in them), and I am perfectly ok in my everyday life.

I am very keen to do the last ever Forestman, but have been wary of committing to entry yet. I am also wary of a doctor just telling me to lay off out of precaution, rather than from experience with athletes. Any thoughts?
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