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Stick around Duncan-all members please read this
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John




Joined: 02 Aug 2004
Posts: 3877
Location: Hebden Bridge, W Yorks

PostPosted: Sat Dec 16, 2006 4:10 pm    Post subject: Stick around Duncan-all members please read this Reply with quote

I can't believe it's come to this - that Duncan, one of TT's most valued members is so p1ssed off that he's thinking about going.

Duncan & I have discussed at length his feelings and reasons but that is private. What I'm about to post are my own feelings, not his.

Recently TT has become less informative, less inspirational and less fun than it ever was. I know for a fact that I am not the only member who feels like this.

When I was starting out in tri, and struggling to become an Ironman, TT members were welcoming, supportive, patient, entertaining and inspirational. I fear that currently we as a forum are not offering that to our members.

LET'S KEEP THIS THREAD CONSTRUCTIVE. Please post constructive agreement or disagreement. If you want to have a pop at me, fine - do it via PM or at mail@johnbaker.vispa.com, or start your own thread.

I rarely post much on TT any more as there's so little that takes my interest. If I get shot down in flames for this I don't care - there are other triathlon forums which currently are better than this one. I do, however, have a soft spot for TT and would like to see it earn back its place as the best British Tri forum. SO - in the interests of having a debate, in my opinion, these are the problems.

1. Too much off-topic stuff, and not enough of it is interesting. I've said this before and got flamed for it, but it makes us look like a joke to new people joining. Suggestion: Gareth, how about a new forum just for off-topic threads? So there would be General, Events, Training, Gear, and Off-topic. Other forums run it like this and it makes it easier to sort the worthwhile threads from the daft ones.

2. Too much negativity. If you are the sort of person who likes to put people down, argue and moan all the time, go somewhere else.

3. We are not inclusive. Yeah yeah I know I'm always accused of political correctness, but please understand there's a difference between holding a private view and discussing it with your mates down the pub, and airing it in a public forum. So if you feel strongly about "all these Asians", or "all these poofs", keep your views off the site. If you seriously don't think there's anything wrong with airing such views on here, then, like I said, go somewhere else.

4. Too much trolling and sock-puppetry. The row between Duncan and Towel was caused by one of our respected members using a sock puppet. You know who you are. Let's not abuse the anonymity of the net. One person, one username.

I'm sure people will moan that what I'm proposing amounts to censorship. That's not it at all. I'm just asking members to observe a little etiquette. At present, everyone posting what they like is not adding to the quality of the forum - it's detracting from it.

Over to you, folks.
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Daz




Joined: 15 May 2003
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PostPosted: Sat Dec 16, 2006 4:17 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Im still fine with TT. Go on forums like Runners world and you'll get even more off topis issues. But you're right, I think the problem now is we need to segregate folders further and have perhaps an off-topic thread thread for joking around, padding,etc. Withe the current general thread being used for general tri-related issues.

We def need to create a new folder(s) to filter out some of the OTs
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doug




Joined: 07 Jan 2004
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PostPosted: Sat Dec 16, 2006 4:20 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Well said TG - Slowtwitch has the Lavender Room for OT threads, it keeps the main forum focussed.

Please stick around Duncan, your input is appreciated
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mdh




Joined: 07 Feb 2006
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PostPosted: Sat Dec 16, 2006 4:23 pm    Post subject: Re: Stick around Duncan-all members please read this Reply with quote

Trainee_God wrote:

4. Too much trolling and sock-puppetry. The row between Duncan and Towel was caused by one of our respected members using a sock puppet. You know who you are. Let's not abuse the anonymity of the net. One person, one username.



Okay I get most of it but can you explain what a sock puppet is?
Matt
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Brian_of_Bozeat




Joined: 20 Apr 2005
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PostPosted: Sat Dec 16, 2006 4:23 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

John my friend.

I feel the same way as you do, In fact i feel similar to Duncan does sometimes.

I rarely post these days either. (in case it had gone un-noticed)

I think TT is a victim of its own success. We used to be a small (ish) group who welcomed others and supported each other but that seems to have gone away with the influx of so many people who dont know or care about the spirit of TT.

But, of course, TT is not ours - it is everyones, I remember a thread about pulling up the drawbridge a while ago and thinking how wrong that was...


The good times are over! Crying or Very sad
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John




Joined: 02 Aug 2004
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Location: Hebden Bridge, W Yorks

PostPosted: Sat Dec 16, 2006 4:25 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

An established user creating a second username so he can cause mischief without people knowing who it really is.

Quote:
Okay I get most of it but can you explain what a sock puppet is?
Matt

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wiganer




Joined: 01 Oct 2006
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PostPosted: Sat Dec 16, 2006 4:27 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I appreciate your comments TG, but as a newcomer in October this year, I have found this site to be nothing but absolutely the best source of information, inspiration and sheer quality and I for one have been welcomed, and not personally abused or insulted or offended.

In fact within a week of joining the forum I had the offer of some free swim coaching which has now developed into a full coaching situation which I will find invaluable for next season. Likewise the number of TTers who have PM me with training info and details has been massively impressive.

Obviously I dont know what the site was like before Oct, but for me it is absolutely essential and THE best site on the web.

I appreciate that all people are different and deal with things differently, but my own view is that we are all big boys and girls and should just rise above it......

If Duncan and Towel cannot resolve it, and I suspect there is more to this than meets the eye, then thats there look-out really.

This great country is built on free-speech and freedom of choice so lets leave it all as it stands.

Thats just my little opinion as a newcomer and no doubt others will disagree but thats my two-penneth anyhows !
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John




Joined: 02 Aug 2004
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Location: Hebden Bridge, W Yorks

PostPosted: Sat Dec 16, 2006 4:37 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:

This great country is built on free-speech and freedom of choice so lets leave it all as it stands.


Wiganer you are right of course but the thing is, this is a triathlon forum where people come to talk about tri. I'm not suggesting people shouldn't talk about other things on here, but that there should be a separate place for it.

Other forums have tighter rules on topics than we do but we shouldn't have to go down that road - just keep the off topic stuff in its own place.
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good4age




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PostPosted: Sat Dec 16, 2006 4:37 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I agree wholeheartedly with Wiganer.

I only joined this year and I have become a huge fan.

TT is informative , entertaining and refreshingly unspoilt.

Long may it continue.

LOL GFA.
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TT
Site Admin



Joined: 22 Aug 2003
Posts: 1495
Location: Vancouver

PostPosted: Sat Dec 16, 2006 4:38 pm    Post subject: Re: Stick around Duncan-all members please read this Reply with quote

Trainee_God wrote:

1. Too much off-topic stuff, and not enough of it is interesting. I've said this before and got flamed for it, but it makes us look like a joke to new people joining. Suggestion: Gareth, how about a new forum just for off-topic threads? So there would be General, Events, Training, Gear, and Off-topic. Other forums run it like this and it makes it easier to sort the worthwhile threads from the daft ones.


Agreed and has been setup. When TT was smaller the lower number of forums worked well, but I think it's time to seperate these OT posts out.

I also think we need some general rules and etiquette for making posts that users are encouraged to read.
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Robert




Joined: 15 May 2003
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PostPosted: Sat Dec 16, 2006 4:40 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I think the OT category is a good idea - I've always been a believer in free speech so long as if I don't want to hear it, I won't. Don't like TV, switch it off. Don't like biased propaganda, don't buy newspapers. Don't like non-triathlon nonsense, don't go into the OT threads.

But, sadly, what's happening on TT is a reflection of society...
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wiganer




Joined: 01 Oct 2006
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Location: walking in a Wigan-Wonderland..

PostPosted: Sat Dec 16, 2006 4:40 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Trainee_God wrote:
Quote:

This great country is built on free-speech and freedom of choice so lets leave it all as it stands.


Wiganer you are right of course but the thing is, this is a triathlon forum where people come to talk about tri. I'm not suggesting people shouldn't talk about other things on here, but that there should be a separate place for it.

Other forums have tighter rules on topics than we do but we shouldn't have to go down that road - just keep the off topic stuff in its own place.


sorry mate (ironic eh)...got me wires crossed with that bit !!! I agree with the OT forum thingy and it has just been created ! Laughing
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Elpasa




Joined: 11 Mar 2006
Posts: 37
Location: On the road to heaven

PostPosted: Sat Dec 16, 2006 4:58 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

As mentioned previously, go to EnduranceUK at

http://enduranceuk.proboards79.com/index.cgi


There you will find:

Training
Advice and discussion about techniques and training for endurance events.

Race Day
Where are you racing? How did it go? Share details of your latest goal.

Medical Tent
Ask or give advice for injury prevention, recovery and support.

Carbo Load
Your thoughts on sports nutrition, diet and weight issues - directly related to endurance sport.

Kit Bag
What is happening in the technical world of equipment.

Ultra Running
Why stop at the marathon? Explore the magical world of ultra and trail running!

The Transition Area
Anything goes (within reason). What are you listening to? Philosophical musings? Daft stories, etc?

For Sale
As it says, if you have something to offer, put it on here.

Suggestion Box
How are we doing? Let us know by offering your suggestions, criticisms and even the occasional pat on the back.

If that ain't enough to choose from then you are just being greedy.
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Dale Cannonman




Joined: 02 Apr 2006
Posts: 2633

PostPosted: Sat Dec 16, 2006 4:59 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Trainee-God Some time ago, I suggested the idea of adding another section for non-triathlon general postings. The majority said no at the time, but perhaps the time is ripe to re-consider. I guess the bottom line is that separating out the general traithlon from the non-triathlon general stuff would only work if we, the members, made it work. In other words, that we know the difference between the two and make our posts accordingly. Having said that, most members are marking their non-triathlon-stuff as "OT" and that seems to work equally well. On balance, I am in favour of keeping the status quo, though I equally support the idea of a new section if that was the view of the majority.

And while I am here, I wouldlike to add my twopennyworth to the wider debate. Yes, Tri-Talk has changed. It is now massive, attarcts a wide publicity and as it has grown, it has attracted an equally wide range of people, views, prejudices, etc. There are members who are keen to know more about triathlon, some who like to joke, some who just like chatting, and a very small minority who like to spoil. Some of these are just wind-up merchants but others are more serious in their motivation as the recent crash demonstrated. More than ever, ours is a very broad church indeed and it is very diffcult to compare the TT of old with what we have today. I tend to agree with Wiganer. Strip away the OT, the dross and the silliness, and you are still left with a hard core of advice, guidance and prcatical, hands on experience. But, and it is a very big but, TT has almost become a victim of its own success. I, like many others, have limited opportunity to access the forum and its sheer size and number of postings means that I regularly miss posts that in the past i would have responded to. I have always gone out of my way to help and assist wherever possible, but its almost become too big a task with the number of questions being asked.

When a long and valued member of our community ups and leaves, it is time to start asking ourselves some serious questions. Do we dismiss it as a lover's tiff and just get on with things, or is it symptomatic of an underlying problem with the forum or its members? The answer, I guess, is a little bit of both. We should not be in the business of trying to limit or restrict membership to only those that contribute positively, but on the other hand, I think we can all add to the betterment of the forum by always ignoring the "wind-up" posts or alternatively, reacting to them in a light-hearted and humorous way. If they happen to be one of "respected" members having a laugh, then let them have their moment of fun, but don't let things get out of hand.

Now being a civil servant, this is perhaps when I start suggesting that we should form a working group to prepare a set of best practice principles for forum ettiquette.............don't worry, I'm getting my coat....


Dale Cannonman Cool Cool
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Spike




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PostPosted: Sat Dec 16, 2006 6:19 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Triing Again and again and again ad nauseam wrote:
The same old twaddle

Give it a rest, will you? Do all the sections on your forum contain the same set of posts? Sounds great if so Rolling Eyes
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