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The sub 3 hour marathon training thread
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r0bh




Joined: 03 Aug 2005
Posts: 1584
Location: Manchester

PostPosted: Wed Sep 17, 2008 9:04 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I'm in for a sub-3 attempt too. Tentative plan is for a 4 month running block Dec - Mar then the Blackpool marathon start of April.

This will be my first marathon but ran a 1:22 half this year so sub-3 is a reasonable target I think.
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waytogoyet




Joined: 17 Sep 2008
Posts: 108
Location: East Yorks

PostPosted: Wed Sep 17, 2008 9:21 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I have aspirations for 2.44.59 at flm next year, however I was hoping to do it via sub 80 half back end of this. however, a bike purchase and triathlon ambitions have somewhat messed up my training!!

This could just be a 'fast marathon thread'
Timmy - cheers . The first 10k I ran after marathon I could only get 37.40 odd, you've obviously got a lot more speed than I have, even now I ran a flat out one to try and get 36.xx thought I was on for it but came out 37.02 - although I and plenty of others clocked it as long

I managed to average 50 miles per week from january through end of april. Within that there were a few missed sessions due to race recovery and a bit of tendonitis. I peaked at 70.
This year I'm going to aim to get close to 70 average. I'm going to go for a slight change of tact, hopefully weds med-long progressive, friday 17 progressive in the dark home from work, sunday 20+. Add in 4 lunchtimes of 6-8 recoveries and an option of saturday rest day or cycle I think that would be ideal training. Its just that nasty friday tea time with the traffic but it is the best time to train for me - in that it doesn't affect family time
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craighalsey




Joined: 22 Mar 2006
Posts: 229
Location: bedfordshire

PostPosted: Wed Sep 17, 2008 9:45 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Last year i went under 3 hours for the first time at stratford 2 hours 46 mins in my third marathon,my prevoius attemps were at luton 3 hours 13 seconds so i had to up my game and i never expected to break the 3 hours as much as i did,but my running plan went kind of like this running 9 miles monday,tuesday,wednesday and friday and then a long run on sunday of 15 miles and over for about 10 weeks building my long runs up to about 22 miles.this year will be much the same with more speed work chucked in cause i want a sub 2 hours 40 at flm and a sub 3 hour at luton in dec.
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alexe




Joined: 20 Feb 2007
Posts: 1025
Location: East London

PostPosted: Wed Sep 17, 2008 10:43 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

finbar wrote:
I have a half marathon at the end of November i'll use to gauge my progress.


Would that be St Neots?
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Tri it man




Joined: 22 Jun 2005
Posts: 1273
Location: Byfleet

PostPosted: Wed Sep 17, 2008 11:14 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Try not to get injured by building up the mileage slowly. 50miles+ of consistent training between Oct and April will bring dividends maybe upping it to 60-70 come Jan-Mar. I'm also doing FLM next year as had a bit of a mare this year. Still did 2.50 but was aiming for sub 2.45. My half time this year was 77.24 for reference but am in much better shape now. Currently up to high 60's low 70's and will probably peak about 80miles. I'm also doing a bit of biking. I think there are quite a few people who can run fast for 10k's but cannot do sub 3 mara. Have seen a lady who has 1.26 half PB and did 2.56 mara so sub 80 is not an indicator of sub 3 as should be much quicker, that should be sub 2.55.
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queasy




Joined: 06 Mar 2007
Posts: 39

PostPosted: Thu Sep 18, 2008 1:55 am    Post subject: sub 3 hr marathon Reply with quote

When training for new york marathon my week look like this
Sunday 10miles of intervel work either 1-5-1min reps with 2 min recs or 10x3mins 90sec recs
monday 5or 6 miles easy
tuesday 8/9miles of fatlek work
wednesday off
thursday long run up to 22miles
friday 5miles easy
sat off or 5miles easy
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timmy




Joined: 07 Sep 2005
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PostPosted: Thu Sep 18, 2008 6:49 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

....Oct week for me 'way back in time' was:
Mon easy rec 6miles
Tue 10miles inc long efforts i.e 3 x 2miles or 6 x 1mile
Wed intermediate run 10miles steady
Thu 6miles inc short efforts 400's, 800's or the like
Fri easy rec 6miles
Sat 6miles at proposed pace run
Sun 15miles run at prop pace +30s per mile

by the time end of March came it had built up to:
Mon easy recovery 6miles
Tue 10miles inc long efforts i.e 3 x 2miles or 6 x 1mile
Wed intermediate run 15miles steady
Thu 8miles inc short efforts 400's, 800's or the like
Fri easy rec 6miles
Sat 10miles at proposed pace run
Sun 20miles run at prop pace +30s per mile

..coupled that training with regular cross country races (usually on the Sat to take the place of the paced run) and some road races(half marathon in early March to check fitness)

The gradual build of the mileage over the months whilst maintaining and in fact increasing the speed was the key. A huge element of luck and support from family is vital. Notice no rest days! - the Monday and Friday easy runs were those!
It worked for me on a number of occasions but not everyone is the same.
By the way, it was 1985 too!! London Marathon 2:35:26.
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rhb




Joined: 17 Jun 2006
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PostPosted: Thu Sep 18, 2008 7:48 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

My initial post on RW:
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5 mile time earlier in year was 30.07 and 10k (after 3 mile run to race) 37.52. Pre injury in 04 my half pb was 1h23.

My long runs in IM prep were always around 7.30 upto 7.55 pace for the longest... 21 miles

All this off steady runs, not massive miles either -biggest month was 105 miles, most normal months are 40 to 50 - level at which the 5 mile time was achieved.

This is Suggesting sub 3.30 is a real possibility almost straight away?

Is a 30 min drop from there a reasonable goal given my background and scope to do much more training?

Plan is to get to spring on mostly base work but a bit of sharpening for a quick 10k on the way... Then more sharpening work through the summer ready for the autumn blast.

________

Ankle is giving me some jip, but once sorted I'll be starting my journey towards sub 3 satisfaction Smile
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finbar




Joined: 28 Oct 2007
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Location: The Dark Peak

PostPosted: Thu Sep 18, 2008 7:58 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

alexe wrote:
finbar wrote:
I have a half marathon at the end of November i'll use to gauge my progress.


Would that be St Neots?


No, Clowne, near Chesterfield). It's not exactly high profile!

Timmy, thanks for the interesting post. Did you ever run doubles?

Also, while i'm here, what weekly mileage are y'all running at the moment/hoping to get to by March? I'm on about 30 at the moment, hoping to hit 50 or higher if no injuries turn up.
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timmy




Joined: 07 Sep 2005
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Location: ...engine started 18/5/11 after 5years!!

PostPosted: Thu Sep 18, 2008 8:03 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

finbar wrote:

Timmy, thanks for the interesting post. Did you ever run doubles?
.


..no, furthest I've ever run is 30miles as an experiment to see if it helped marathon training - which it didn't - I was just knackered!
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Tri it man




Joined: 22 Jun 2005
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PostPosted: Thu Sep 18, 2008 9:09 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

timmy wrote:
finbar wrote:

Timmy, thanks for the interesting post. Did you ever run doubles?
.


..no, furthest I've ever run is 30miles as an experiment to see if it helped marathon training - which it didn't - I was just knackered!


Did he mean doubles as in running twice a day. I have been doing doubles over the last month or so and did them for a period before a marathon. So yesterday did 6mile recovery run am and 7 hard pm. Today will also do a double but make it a medium pace at lunchtime (7miles) and an easy run this evening (8miles). If you do doubles make the morning or 1st run the easy run like recovery. It's all about time on your feet. Slow miles over a period of time will pay dividends.
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timmy




Joined: 07 Sep 2005
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Location: ...engine started 18/5/11 after 5years!!

PostPosted: Thu Sep 18, 2008 11:12 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Tri it man wrote:
timmy wrote:
finbar wrote:

Timmy, thanks for the interesting post. Did you ever run doubles?
.


..no, furthest I've ever run is 30miles as an experiment to see if it helped marathon training - which it didn't - I was just knackered!


Did he mean doubles as in running twice a day. I have been doing doubles over the last month or so and did them for a period before a marathon. So yesterday did 6mile recovery run am and 7 hard pm. Today will also do a double but make it a medium pace at lunchtime (7miles) and an easy run this evening (8miles). If you do doubles make the morning or 1st run the easy run like recovery. It's all about time on your feet. Slow miles over a period of time will pay dividends.


..I used to run or bike to and from work(only 3 miles each way), I worked shifts so it would be 6/2, 2/10, or nights - you just seem to be forever running but the stamina it gives you is enormous.!
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Hadders




Joined: 23 Jun 2008
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Location: Hertfordshire

PostPosted: Thu Sep 18, 2008 12:35 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Hi all,

Some great reading here - nice to know people are chasing the same challenge.
Coming off the back of IMUK (not run since!) but feel 'base' fitness is pretty sound. Looking now to increase speed work in the form of track sessions/interval etc
Aim to clock around 40-50 miles per week as of next few weeks in lead up to Luton in Dec. 10k lined up end of October to see where we're at and if all good, we'll give it a go.
Anyone else in for Luton?
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Chris G




Joined: 29 May 2008
Posts: 165
Location: Recovering before the next session

PostPosted: Thu Sep 18, 2008 4:52 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I'm planning to try for sub 3 at Edinburgh next year - 31st May. There's about 50metres overall descent on the course and I'm praying for light winds Exclamation I've done an 82 half so I'm reasonably confident of breaking 3 but I know a few guys who should have easily made it but not done so due to their quads stiffening up - a lack of road running pehaps?? Thinking of going for some winter training along these lines http://www.tritalk.co.uk/forums/viewtopic.php?t=21000 and focussing on the run from March onwards.
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The Anti Coach




Joined: 04 May 2007
Posts: 318

PostPosted: Thu Sep 18, 2008 5:19 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Greetings all!

A few thoughts from someone who's done 3:02:55, 3:01:28, 3:00:37, 2:55:14 (in that order!)

1:23 is the minimum half pb required for a sub 3

Never try and run for more than 2:30 on your long runs and run them dead slow (you may have to violate this rule once to get a +20 mile run in)

Occasionally run 'progressive' on the long run, ie 1:45 slow followed by 45' marathon pace

Lactate threshold intervals are the key speed session

Never do more than 2 hard days in a row

Never go hard the day after a run exceeding 2 hours

Keep marathon pace runs between 10 and 12 miles and run at marathon EFFORT, not target marathon speed

Do 1 run 14-15 miles at target marathon speed around 8 weeks out to see where you are

Longest run 3 weeks out

10 mile race or 2:30 slow run 2 weeks out

Do leg strengthening exercises to slow the inevitable onset of achilles/calf stiffness around the 20 mile point

Analyze your old schedules and work out what your average weekly mileages were in previous marathons - you may be surprised at what you find! Don't try and exceed this number, this is your limit.

Hydrate on long runs


Hope helpful
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