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How bad at swimming am I?
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JaRok2300




Joined: 01 May 2014
Posts: 330
Location: Worcester, UK

PostPosted: Wed Apr 25, 2018 10:01 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I've got one of those rear racks that just clamps around the seatpost. Just big enough for a dry bag and don't really notice it once cycling.
There are loads of cheap ones on ebay so worth a punt without forking out too much dosh. I also use it if I ride to Parkrun etc for trainers and other bits and bobs.
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Chrace




Joined: 28 Apr 2010
Posts: 2692
Location: Eating a Yorkie

PostPosted: Wed Apr 25, 2018 11:56 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Backpack. HTFU.
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Where the mind goes the body follows.
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PhilleusPhogg




Joined: 11 May 2015
Posts: 263

PostPosted: Wed Apr 25, 2018 4:21 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Tin Pot wrote:

Anyone know any good tricks for cycling after OW swimming? Iím thinking that covering myself in goose fat and doing my OW swims in budgie smuglers, then jumping straight on the bike and going for a long hilly ride home is going to be pretty trick.


FTYFY
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Tin Pot




Joined: 08 Jul 2013
Posts: 2469
Location: Bromley

PostPosted: Thu Apr 26, 2018 6:47 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Thanks guys, I now realise the error of my ways!
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Iron Ď17 16h11, '16 14h30
Half Iron '17 7h39, 6h28 '16 5h53
Olympic '16 3h18 '15 3h33, '13 3h36
Sprint '16 1h17, '14 1h40, '13 2h01
Half Mara '16 2h04, '14 2h07
10 Mile TT '16 00:26:30
Trail 10K '16 54:01 '13 54:46
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Pedro Peru




Joined: 19 Apr 2010
Posts: 949
Location: Leeds

PostPosted: Thu Apr 26, 2018 9:42 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Started swimming with the local masters group, once a week, over the last few weeks and I'm really enjoying it. Mostly chasing toes for the whole session but I'm sure I will improve. What surprised me was the totally different social dynamic from swimming with the tri club. Generally a lot less chatting when we should be swimming and fewer egos encountered so far.
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Jgav




Joined: 06 Dec 2016
Posts: 251

PostPosted: Fri Apr 27, 2018 8:06 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Swam this morning, was in a lane with faster swimmers and did a 3.30 200m. Then switched lanes (got too busy) and did a 400m TT, felt like I was going full gas and came in 7.50. Is that a normal drop off at that distance?

I know I need to swim more...
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stenard




Joined: 04 Sep 2013
Posts: 1483

PostPosted: Fri Apr 27, 2018 9:03 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I wouldnt say there is such a thing as a "normal" drop off. The extent of the drop off is going to depend on a number of factors that reflect an individuals skill set and fitness. But I suppose on the face of it, that does seem excessive.

To put in context, on my training camp last week, as part of a long endurance pool set we did a conceptual CSS test (I say conceptual, because I wouldnt normally do a CSS test when I'm already shattered!). I did a 5:54 400 followed by a 2:52 200. So that's only a difference in pace/100m of 2s/100. Your drop off is 10s/100, and that seems quite high.

How much rest had you had between the 200 and the 400? If you hadn't taken a good few minutes before the 400m, then you are quite likely to fatigue and lose a fair chunk of time in the later lengths.
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Buzz_




Joined: 19 May 2007
Posts: 285

PostPosted: Fri Apr 27, 2018 9:28 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Also, if I'm reading your post correctly, you were following fast feet for the 200 but solo for the 400? In my experience that makes a huge difference.
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stenard




Joined: 04 Sep 2013
Posts: 1483

PostPosted: Fri Apr 27, 2018 9:42 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Buzz_ wrote:
Also, if I'm reading your post correctly, you were following fast feet for the 200 but solo for the 400? In my experience that makes a huge difference.

That's true. I can swim a sub6 400 when drafting in the pool and feel fairly relaxed. A sub6 in clear water is on the limit. It makes a massive difference.
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JaRok2300




Joined: 01 May 2014
Posts: 330
Location: Worcester, UK

PostPosted: Fri Apr 27, 2018 2:23 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Swim smooth quote <4% as the target for drop off between 400m & 200m pace.

Having said that you did the swims the other way round to their test (they recommend 400m first as 200m is less affected by tiredness) and what has already been said about drafting.

http://www.feelforthewater.com/2013/01/becoming-diesel-engine.html
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TriSam




Joined: 26 Aug 2011
Posts: 1224
Location: Tunbridge Wells

PostPosted: Sat Apr 28, 2018 1:50 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

5k at the Swimathon this morning. Did it long course after a winter of not much training, just snuck inside 1:20 so quite happy I haven't dropped off a huge amount.

Need to get back into it!
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PhilleusPhogg




Joined: 11 May 2015
Posts: 263

PostPosted: Tue May 01, 2018 12:39 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Nice work Sam.

Saw a few folks on Facebook and Strava doing the 5K swims, it's a pretty impressive undertaking, seems like a pretty monotonous undertaking (although I guess if you're good at swimming you might be able to get into a nice rhythm and switch off for a bit and let the mind wander?)
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TriSam




Joined: 26 Aug 2011
Posts: 1224
Location: Tunbridge Wells

PostPosted: Fri May 04, 2018 10:58 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Yeah 5k in a pool is not the most enjoyable experience! I did it with a training partner and we rotated after doing 500m on the front each time, which broke it up quite nicely.

I think 5k in a lake would be okay, but there's nothing except for some feet and a black line to keep you company in the pool
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Jgav




Joined: 06 Dec 2016
Posts: 251

PostPosted: Fri May 11, 2018 10:34 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Thanks for the comments above, I think I had a bit of a draft but not that much, it was more the pressure of keeping up the speed with the faster swimmers. Will try it the correct way round next time.

So trying to add in some swim consistency (since I've hurt my foot this week it's pretty much a must).

Jumped in and did 700m in 14.06 before some faster 100s which came in at 1.42,1.44,1.45. For the long stretch I'm really trying to work on keeping my legs and hips up and using the rotation to drive the power rather than shoulders. Not sure if it's helping or just pushing my head lower as I seem to swallow more water. May need to think about head positioning a bit more to stop that.

My target is to get to sub 30 olympic/38 HIM swims. Anything better is a bonus in my eyes given how little swimming I do.
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stenard




Joined: 04 Sep 2013
Posts: 1483

PostPosted: Mon May 21, 2018 2:23 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Rekindling the actual subject line of this thread, it seems I'm a totally $hite OW swimmer. I'm just not seeing any of the gains I have made in the pool translate to my OW swimming. It's getting rather frustrating.

I have 3 reference points in the last 2 weeks.

Race 1 - 432m pool sprint (36m pool) - I swam 1:29/100 pace and felt easy. I even got held up by a line of 6 swimmers that I caught up with about 100m still to go, and just had to sit behind them. Ave HR 165bpm, max 173bpm.

Race 2 - 1,900m sea swim in Mallorca. Watch had it bang on distance wise, mat to mat, which means a good 100m or more of that was actually running into and out of the sea. I averaged 1:39/100m pace. People who I swim with regularly from my club, and am only a few seconds per 100m slower than at most, put over 4 minutes into me. People who are significantly slower than me, got within 90s of me. I hit my highest HR of the entire 70.3 in the swim, so I definitely did not "undercook" it effort wise. Ave HR 174bpm, max 187bpm.

Race 3 - 1,500m lake swim in Southport. Watch had it as only 1,450m and me swimming at 1:43/100m pace. That is simply awful. In a pool, I would physically have to not even try and swim to go that slowly. After Mallorca, I tried some tips from our club swim coach and other top swimmers to breath every 2 rather than bilaterally, and to up the cadence with more choppy strokes. It felt worse. I do accept this swim is likely hampered by Mallorca fatigue (as was my bike and run, where I held less power than I did in the 70.3, and ran the 10k slower than my first 10k of the HM), but this is still excessively slow based on my pool times. Ave HR 177bpm, max 185bpm.

Any further thoughts? My sighting is decent, so that's not the issue. I have a Huub Archimedes II 3:5 wetsuit that feels amazing and totally unrestrictive compared to my previous 2XU one.

I'm going to try and get a specific OW lesson with our club swim coach who knows what I swim like in the pool and sees me weekly there, but in the meantime I'm interested to see if there are any simple "wins" to try and experiment with.
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