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The Sub 11 Ironman Thread
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Poet.




Joined: 06 Aug 2013
Posts: 270

PostPosted: Mon Oct 29, 2018 10:39 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

WTC have gone soft for sure.
I was going to post the 4:40 bike times may have something to do with that...

...thing is; some of these folks can’t ride a bike.
Their idea of “holding a wheel” is sitting >2m back. (Mine is about 2cm)
They grab the (ridiculously overpowered) disc brakes constantly.
Come through for “their turn” at >10kmh faster than the train and overshoot the front.
Can’t climb and can’t descend.
There’s also a MASSIVE over-reliance on tech (Navigation units, power meters, etc)...sometimes zaps the fun out of it.
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Jorgan




Joined: 12 Nov 2007
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Location: alles was ich bin, alles was ich war

PostPosted: Mon Oct 29, 2018 10:48 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Poet. wrote:
...thing is; some of these folks can’t ride a bike.
Their idea of “holding a wheel” is sitting >2m back. (Mine is about 2cm)
They grab the (ridiculously overpowered) disc brakes constantly.
Come through for “their turn” at >10kmh faster than the train and overshoot the front.
Can’t climb and can’t descend.
There’s also a MASSIVE over-reliance on tech (Navigation units, power meters, etc)...sometimes zaps the fun out of it.


Sorry, who's 'they'...people you have ridden with on club runs, triathlonists or both?

You know that about 2m back is common in Ironman events these days Wink
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JeffB




Joined: 04 May 2008
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Location: Middlesbrough

PostPosted: Mon Oct 29, 2018 11:16 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Jorgan wrote:
Poet. wrote:
...thing is; some of these folks can’t ride a bike.
Their idea of “holding a wheel” is sitting >2m back. (Mine is about 2cm)
They grab the (ridiculously overpowered) disc brakes constantly.
Come through for “their turn” at >10kmh faster than the train and overshoot the front.
Can’t climb and can’t descend.
There’s also a MASSIVE over-reliance on tech (Navigation units, power meters, etc)...sometimes zaps the fun out of it.


Sorry, who's 'they'...people you have ridden with on club runs, triathlonists or both?

You know that about 2m back is common in Ironman events these days Wink


I think the 2m is from the front of the pack to the back they are riding in Wink

As far as bike splits go, things like cheaper wind tunnels and aero testing, skinsuits etc. have also helped with that.

Jeff
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tuckandgo




Joined: 03 Sep 2012
Posts: 421

PostPosted: Mon Oct 29, 2018 11:22 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Poet. wrote:
Nice work Jorgan - that’s a solid week.

Yup, Kona is cyclical, too.
Meaning, you get the same people doing it every two to three years.
They seem to have an easier year, then a build year, then qualify and go to Kona.

Having returned to the sport, I can’t quite believe how much better everyone is on a bike. The prevalence of power meters, indoor trainers and, ultimately, education, has led to much better fitness.
Still, not many people can swim or run.

Swim - 1:15
Bike - 4:40
Run - 3:40


Bags about a 9:35.


If you can do a 4.40 on the bike you can do way faster than a 3.40 run. I'm a crap runner and if I improved on the bike to a 4.40 (currently anywhere between 5.15 on a flat to 5.50ish at Wales) I would be running 3.15 or faster.

(I would also have to break my genetic limitations, but that's another issue Rolling Eyes )
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Wheezy




Joined: 10 Oct 2007
Posts: 1780
Location: Sub 3 (elect)

PostPosted: Mon Oct 29, 2018 11:44 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

A mixed bag. Finally shaking my cough so I was able to string some sessions together.

mon-rest
Tues - 2hr45 / 48m bike. Steady
Wed - 40min swim 15x100. just getting back into the water after a 10 day layoff. very steady.
Thu-1hr turbo Trainerroad (black)
Fri-15x100 off 2:10. All reps finished between 1.42-45. Was blowing hard at the end but quite pleased with this. Smile
Sat- 5km wu slow run then 5km parkrun (21:1Cool. started at the back and increased pace throughout the run.
Sun- 3hr15 / 50m bike. Very steady. Quite hilly.

9hrs25 mins total
519TSS (doesn't include swimming; need to do my CSS test this week)

My injured foot's flared up agin within hours of my run on Saturday. Sad So I'm going to book into seeing another physio asap as I really need to get to the bottom of it. Other than that, back on the horse. Smile
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mattsurf




Joined: 28 Sep 2016
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PostPosted: Mon Oct 29, 2018 12:43 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Jorgan wrote:
finally top of the Strava board


I think you may have looking at 2nd position, behind my 14h29m
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Jorgan




Joined: 12 Nov 2007
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PostPosted: Mon Oct 29, 2018 1:24 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

mattsurf wrote:
Jorgan wrote:
finally top of the Strava board


I think you may have looking at 2nd position, behind my 14h29m


FFS, you added a session later in the day then. I only need the 13:20 to school you in Hamburg next year though* If I logged my hot yoga, I'd be through the roof.


*once I've dealt with Poet at the 113.
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Poet.




Joined: 06 Aug 2013
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PostPosted: Mon Oct 29, 2018 1:59 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Jorgan - Both. Grr!!!

tuckandgo - check out the first 10 male finishers from Outlaw 2018. Five of them have splits in that ballpark (4:40-5:00 bike, 3:50-3:25 run)
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Jorgan




Joined: 12 Nov 2007
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Location: alles was ich bin, alles was ich war

PostPosted: Mon Oct 29, 2018 2:20 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Poet. wrote:
Jorgan - Both. Grr!!!

tuckandgo - check out the first 10 male finishers from Outlaw 2018. Five of them have splits in that ballpark (4:40-5:00 bike, 3:50-3:25 run)


Outlaw is a pretty small sample, but yes I can imagine some people over-egging the bike and then 'only' being able to run around 3:50. How many people have biked 4:40 at Outlaw though, maybe a couple, and they were running faster than 3:50.
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mattsurf




Joined: 28 Sep 2016
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Location: Zug, Switzerland

PostPosted: Mon Oct 29, 2018 2:52 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Enjoying the last of daylight last week, lots of zone 2 work on the bike, with some structured intervals i.e. climbing big hills. Managed to clear 1000km and 10,000m climbing for the month

Apparently Swiss drivers are only polite to cyclists in the summer, in the winter, when it is cold and raining, bikes are not permitted to inconvenience drivers.

First week with a decent amount of run training, following 5 weeks with very little running due to injury. 2 * 10km sessions at 5m30 pace, then on Sunday did a 16km, with middle 10km at 4:40m/km

Trying to reinvent my swim technique (again)... I seem to be making progress. Getting out of the water 15-20mins behind Jorgan would give me too much work to do.

This winter training is all focused on consistent run and bike Z2 efforts with intervals and possibly 1 short hard session per week

Tomorrow is FTP test day. Not looking forward to it
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Poet.




Joined: 06 Aug 2013
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PostPosted: Mon Oct 29, 2018 3:57 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Jorgan wrote:
Poet. wrote:
Jorgan - Both. Grr!!!

tuckandgo - check out the first 10 male finishers from Outlaw 2018. Five of them have splits in that ballpark (4:40-5:00 bike, 3:50-3:25 run)


Outlaw is a pretty small sample, but yes I can imagine some people over-egging the bike and then 'only' being able to run around 3:50. How many people have biked 4:40 at Outlaw though, maybe a couple, and they were running faster than 3:50.


Kevin Dawson
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Jorgan




Joined: 12 Nov 2007
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Location: alles was ich bin, alles was ich war

PostPosted: Mon Oct 29, 2018 4:00 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Poet. wrote:
Jorgan wrote:


Outlaw is a pretty small sample, but yes I can imagine some people over-egging the bike and then 'only' being able to run around 3:50. How many people have biked 4:40 at Outlaw though, maybe a couple, and they were running faster than 3:50.


Kevin Dawson


Yeah, him and the guy who won last year, Kit Walker. He defo ran faster than 3:50 Smile
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Poet.




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PostPosted: Mon Oct 29, 2018 6:22 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Alright, so maybe I over-egged the ratio - soz...
Name: Bike, Run
Kevin Dawson: 4:35, 3:35
Andy Sloan: 4:45, 3:47

Then, look at two other Top 10 male finishers
Eugene Grant: 5:00, 3:29
Scott Hill: 5:00, 3:23

Much more “triathlon”

I’d be interested to have a look at the flat course Euro IMs, a subset of M35-59, to find the stats out...
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Poet.




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PostPosted: Mon Oct 29, 2018 6:23 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Nice work there, Wheezy!
Hope the foot gets sorted soon
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mattsurf




Joined: 28 Sep 2016
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PostPosted: Mon Oct 29, 2018 8:03 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Poet. wrote:
Alright, so maybe I over-egged the ratio - soz...
Name: Bike, Run
Kevin Dawson: 4:35, 3:35
Andy Sloan: 4:45, 3:47

Then, look at two other Top 10 male finishers
Eugene Grant: 5:00, 3:29
Scott Hill: 5:00, 3:23

Much more “triathlon”

I’d be interested to have a look at the flat course Euro IMs, a subset of M35-59, to find the stats out...


I know Scott Hill, he is a pretty good cyclist and runner... He did a 4:31 bike in Kona, followed by a 4h run
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