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Jorgan




Joined: 12 Nov 2007
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Location: alles was ich bin, alles was ich war

PostPosted: Wed Mar 22, 2017 1:33 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

hammerer wrote:
explorerJC wrote:


I'm not usually employed to keep the tat parlours busy.....our good friend k. would get arsy if I did...


You should add that to Coach Ed. Anyone with the tat , instant fail and anyone coaching people with the tat struck off.


But I expect it's mandatory in the T&Cs for Ironman University(TM) coaches Very Happy
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hammerer




Joined: 19 Nov 2007
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PostPosted: Wed Mar 22, 2017 2:34 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Jorgan wrote:
hammerer wrote:
explorerJC wrote:


I'm not usually employed to keep the tat parlours busy.....our good friend k. would get arsy if I did...


You should add that to Coach Ed. Anyone with the tat , instant fail and anyone coaching people with the tat struck off.


But I expect it's mandatory in the T&Cs for Ironman University(TM) coaches Very Happy


All coaches are required that along with a list of recommended physio, bike fitter and running specialist, a list of WTC endorsed tattoo artists is also kept
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Jorgan




Joined: 12 Nov 2007
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Location: alles was ich bin, alles was ich war

PostPosted: Wed Mar 22, 2017 3:35 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

hammerer wrote:

All coaches are required that along with a list of recommended physio, bike fitter and running specialist, a list of WTC endorsed tattoo artists is also kept


Don't forget that they expect you to bang-on about it on social media too; especially if it involves a 10% discount on an affiliated product #profamateur
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explorerJC




Joined: 20 Oct 2005
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PostPosted: Thu Mar 23, 2017 4:26 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Jorgan wrote:
hammerer wrote:

All coaches are required that along with a list of recommended physio, bike fitter and running specialist, a list of WTC endorsed tattoo artists is also kept


Don't forget that they expect you to bang-on about it on social media too; especially if it involves a 10% discount on an affiliated product #profamateur


My 10% discount currently has a 90% discount...
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Thing of the Fountains




Joined: 06 Jul 2010
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PostPosted: Sun Mar 26, 2017 1:30 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Jorgan wrote:
I've learned as much through experience in the last 22 years doing endurance sport, than I did on a degree course.

If you want a 10h finish to be a formality on 8-10h a week, as a 43 yr old with a 2 & 6 yr old, then look at me, and wonder if I'm doing something right


Cool, but what if I want a half-decent time like 9.59.59 ? Who do I look at then? Wink
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explorerJC




Joined: 20 Oct 2005
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PostPosted: Sun Mar 26, 2017 6:20 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Thing of the Fountains wrote:
Jorgan wrote:
I've learned as much through experience in the last 22 years doing endurance sport, than I did on a degree course.

If you want a 10h finish to be a formality on 8-10h a week, as a 43 yr old with a 2 & 6 yr old, then look at me, and wonder if I'm doing something right


Cool, but what if I want a half-decent time like 9.59.59 ? Who do I look at then? Wink


Smile
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Cat5 in the Hat




Joined: 14 Mar 2011
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Location: Berks

PostPosted: Sun Mar 26, 2017 7:31 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Jorgan wrote:
hammerer wrote:
explorerJC wrote:


I'm not usually employed to keep the tat parlours busy.....our good friend k. would get arsy if I did...


You should add that to Coach Ed. Anyone with the tat , instant fail and anyone coaching people with the tat struck off.


But I expect it's mandatory in the T&Cs for Ironman University(TM) coaches Very Happy


Can you get an IM University tatoo? Now that would be funny to see.
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hammerer




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PostPosted: Mon Mar 27, 2017 8:01 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Cat5 in the Hat wrote:
Jorgan wrote:
hammerer wrote:
explorerJC wrote:


I'm not usually employed to keep the tat parlours busy.....our good friend k. would get arsy if I did...


You should add that to Coach Ed. Anyone with the tat , instant fail and anyone coaching people with the tat struck off.


But I expect it's mandatory in the T&Cs for Ironman University(TM) coaches Very Happy


Can you get an IM University tatoo? Now that would be funny to see.


You do get permission to stick a logo on your facebook profile.....which has already changed. Be 100's of "coaches" going out getting cover ups done and reinked Wink

I must admit I have a passing interest in the IM course to see what it actually is, but not enough to spend 700 bucks on it. Im guessing its a rehash of Friels books although there's input from the likes of Dave Scott and Matt Dixon. Might actually be some useful resources in there.
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Jorgan




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PostPosted: Mon Mar 27, 2017 8:40 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

hammerer wrote:

I must admit I have a passing interest in the IM course to see what it actually is, but not enough to spend 700 bucks on it. Im guessing its a rehash of Friels books although there's input from the likes of Dave Scott and Matt Dixon. Might actually be some useful resources in there.


Quite. I think until you've had the opportunity to compare the Ironman course to the BTF L1 or 2 courses, then it's hard to make a (comparative) value judgement.

My stance would be the same for either - what experience does this person have in endurance sports, what results have they had with others, and do they look at more than just prescribing a program. Even if someone doesn't just dole-out cookie cutter plans, do they look at everything from lifestyle and commitments, to what equipment people are using & their set-up on the bike.

I see plenty of coached people who look like a dog's breakfast on the bike.
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hammerer




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PostPosted: Mon Mar 27, 2017 10:14 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Jorgan wrote:
hammerer wrote:

I must admit I have a passing interest in the IM course to see what it actually is, but not enough to spend 700 bucks on it. Im guessing its a rehash of Friels books although there's input from the likes of Dave Scott and Matt Dixon. Might actually be some useful resources in there.


Quite. I think until you've had the opportunity to compare the Ironman course to the BTF L1 or 2 courses, then it's hard to make a (comparative) value judgement.

My stance would be the same for either - what experience does this person have in endurance sports, what results have they had with others, and do they look at more than just prescribing a program. Even if someone doesn't just dole-out cookie cutter plans, do they look at everything from lifestyle and commitments, to what equipment people are using & their set-up on the bike.

I see plenty of coached people who look like a dog's breakfast on the bike.


BTF level 2 surprised me as there's quite a lot of good info. I was expecting a boring few days just to get insured but it was more than that. The course has since changed to be more practical but mine unfortunately due to time constraints there was very little on the actual sports, about half a day on each, so time to study some drills, some technical analysis, and basic bike fitting, looking at running mechanics etc. Sports science section was again interesting but relatively basic for anyone that's done any level of competitive sport and taken an interest. Apart from the 5 days of the course I must've spent the best part of 70 or 80 hours outside on completing the folder, linked session plans, taking sessions, all the RA and EAPs for the venues, child protection stuff, planing an OW swim session with all the H&S etc. So a lot of practical experience gained in the real world which I'm not sure a 13hr online course can give. I do think you get out what you put in and it shows. My folder was apparently one of the best there but I really engaged and looked around the subjects, but i was shocked that people turned up to the assessment day without even having finished their folders let alone put effort into the content.

L3 is a different level though and takes about a year to complete. I really want to get on that but want to build my skills a lot more first so that i go in with a lot more understanding of different athletes in the real world. If i was to do 1 to 1 type coaching Id rather work poolside with them as how can i improve someones swim who is 200 miles away. I can make them good at swimming badly, but Id rather someone who was slow at swimming well as they will beat the former!
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Tony Stark




Joined: 26 Apr 2007
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PostPosted: Mon Mar 27, 2017 11:06 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Back slightly to the original subject, what threw me a lot during my daughter's application process recently is that Oxford and Cambridge now send out very mixed messages. They claim to mark you down if you turn up for interview in anything resembling smart clothes, and only seek evidence of interest and ability in the subject you are applying for, with extra-curricular activities being ignored completely. Pretty much every other university seems to have almost no selection process whatsoever other than filling in an application form, possibly receiving a conditional grade offer for more popular courses, and requiring the fees to be paid by day 1 of commencement.
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explorerJC




Joined: 20 Oct 2005
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PostPosted: Mon Mar 27, 2017 11:58 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

L3 doesn't teach you to coach one to one, it qualifies you to do so...similar to the L2, it simply opens the door to opportunity. Most coaching is facilitation of training either directly or remotely and as much as we'd like to spend all our time improving technique or form, the reality is somewhat different.

It's easy to critique a "coached" athlete whose bike handling skills or swimming form is less than you'd wish, but without appreciating the full circumstances, a criticism in isolation is no more than that. As a generalisation, too many coaches intervene too quickly. That said, in a recent conversation with a Lboro squad athlete, no stroke feedback had ever been provided in years of training from an "elite coach" which I found quite alarming. Also, on my L3, an elite athlete had not made the connection between a recurring running injury and a lack of functional conditioning. That her coaching team also had not is even more alarming.

I have not completed the IM course but know a few people who have. Not being in need of the potential extra advertising, I don't think I will take it up. However, whilst the course may not necessarily teach me anything new it may at least challenge me to think why do I already know what I know and how can I improve my argument for what I currently deliver. That aspect of continual learning is often missing in education today.
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Cat5 in the Hat




Joined: 14 Mar 2011
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PostPosted: Mon Mar 27, 2017 4:54 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

hammerer wrote:

BTF level 2 surprised me as there's quite a lot of good info. I was expecting a boring few days just to get insured but it was more than that. The course has since changed to be more practical but mine unfortunately due to time constraints there was very little on the actual sports, about half a day on each, so time to study some drills, some technical analysis, and basic bike fitting, looking at running mechanics etc. Sports science section was again interesting but relatively basic for anyone that's done any level of competitive sport and taken an interest. Apart from the 5 days of the course I must've spent the best part of 70 or 80 hours outside on completing the folder, linked session plans, taking sessions, all the RA and EAPs for the venues, child protection stuff, planing an OW swim session with all the H&S etc. So a lot of practical experience gained in the real world which I'm not sure a 13hr online course can give. I do think you get out what you put in and it shows. My folder was apparently one of the best there but I really engaged and looked around the subjects, but i was shocked that people turned up to the assessment day without even having finished their folders let alone put effort into the content.


This. All of it. The blood, sweat and tears of getting the damn thing done. The shock and surprise that others hadn't. My portfolio went to the US and Taiwan too.

Some upcoming L2s in my club have reported back that there is no OW swimming in the new L2.

In terms of L3, I am considering the ABCC as a single-sport L3. More from the what can I learn and how will it improve me.
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explorerJC




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PostPosted: Mon Mar 27, 2017 6:56 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Cat5 in the Hat wrote:
hammerer wrote:

BTF level 2 surprised me as there's quite a lot of good info. I was expecting a boring few days just to get insured but it was more than that. The course has since changed to be more practical but mine unfortunately due to time constraints there was very little on the actual sports, about half a day on each, so time to study some drills, some technical analysis, and basic bike fitting, looking at running mechanics etc. Sports science section was again interesting but relatively basic for anyone that's done any level of competitive sport and taken an interest. Apart from the 5 days of the course I must've spent the best part of 70 or 80 hours outside on completing the folder, linked session plans, taking sessions, all the RA and EAPs for the venues, child protection stuff, planing an OW swim session with all the H&S etc. So a lot of practical experience gained in the real world which I'm not sure a 13hr online course can give. I do think you get out what you put in and it shows. My folder was apparently one of the best there but I really engaged and looked around the subjects, but i was shocked that people turned up to the assessment day without even having finished their folders let alone put effort into the content.


This. All of it. The blood, sweat and tears of getting the damn thing done. The shock and surprise that others hadn't. My portfolio went to the US and Taiwan too.

Some upcoming L2s in my club have reported back that there is no OW swimming in the new L2.

In terms of L3, I am considering the ABCC as a single-sport L3. More from the what can I learn and how will it improve me.


L2 OW forms both part of the theory and online assessment. Personally I prefer a practical and this is still available as CPD
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explorerJC




Joined: 20 Oct 2005
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PostPosted: Mon Mar 27, 2017 7:13 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Tony Stark wrote:
Back slightly to the original subject, what threw me a lot during my daughter's application process recently is that Oxford and Cambridge now send out very mixed messages. They claim to mark you down if you turn up for interview in anything resembling smart clothes, and only seek evidence of interest and ability in the subject you are applying for, with extra-curricular activities being ignored completely. Pretty much every other university seems to have almost no selection process whatsoever other than filling in an application form, possibly receiving a conditional grade offer for more popular courses, and requiring the fees to be paid by day 1 of commencement.


In the first case, very sad and the second even sadder still
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